[TheThinkTank] THE LIST

La Bikery labikery at gmail.com
Tue May 26 13:44:51 PDT 2015


La Bikery in Moncton NB Canada isn't on the list yet that I know of!

Thanks :)




*Coopérative La Bikery Co-operative*
*Centre de vélo communautaire *
*Community Bicycle Centre*


*120 boul. Assomption blvd,*
* Moncton NB*


*Jeudis: 17 h à 20 h *
* Thursdays:  5 pm - 8 pm*
*Samedis: 11 h à 14 h*
*        Saturdays: 11 pm - 2 pm*



<http://labikery.ca/>

<https://www.facebook.com/LaBikery> <https://twitter.com/LaBikery>

*CHECK US OUT BY CLICKING ON THE LINKS ABOVE*

On Sun, May 24, 2015 at 10:16 PM, Angel York <aniola at gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
> *What I want to avoid supporting are people using a 501c status to
> "recycle" bikes for a personal profit (an astonishing number of people) I'm
> also wary of the religious non-profits using bikes as an evangelical tool
> (also a surprisingly large number).*
> I haven't encountered these.  Could you provide examples? While you can
> work for a 501c, the IRS has the following to say:
> The organization must not be organized or operated for the benefit of private
> interests
> <http://www.irs.gov/Charities-&-Non-Profits/Charitable-Organizations/Inurement-Private-Benefit-Charitable-Organizations>,
> and no part of a section 501(c)(3) organization's net earnings may inure to
> the benefit of any private shareholder or individual. If the organization
> engages in an excess benefit transaction
> <http://www.irs.gov/Charities-&-Non-Profits/Charitable-Organizations/Intermediate-Sanctions-Excess-Benefit-Transactions>
> with a person having substantial influence over the organization, an excise
> tax
> <http://www.irs.gov/Charities-&-Non-Profits/Charitable-Organizations/Intermediate-Sanctions>
> may be imposed on the person and any organization managers agreeing to the
> transaction.
>
> http://www.irs.gov/Charities-&-Non-Profits/Charitable-Organizations/Exemption-Requirements-Section-501%28c%29%283%29-Organizations
>
> I'm aware of Bike Churches (the original one started on Church Street),
> but not of religious organizations using bikes as an evangelical tool.
> Except maybe to evangelize about bikes and biking?
>
> *All that said, THE LIST is getting a lot of request from charities and
> educational non-profits. It's difficult for me to know who is actually
> innovating with social relationships and who is just filling a local
> material need. Both are important. Suggestions? *
>
> If they are both important, then I would list anyone who asks.  I would
> expect that people are mostly going to be looking at your list to figure
> out who their local bike-related organizations are.
>
> On Sun, May 24, 2015 at 5:32 PM, Angel York <aniola at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> *As long as co-op are exploring ways of distributing decision making
>> power than I think they qualify for my purposes.*
>> For instance, I can think of a food *co-op* that is run by a board of
>> directors, and a has a *standard hierarchical management structure*.
>> The owners (many of the shoppers) in theory can vote on big decisions, but
>> if the food co-op already has an outcome in mind, that is absolutely going
>> to skew the vote.
>>
>> My current food* co-op *is run by a board of directors, and has a*
>> collective management structure. * The owners (many of the shoppers) in
>> theory can vote on big decisions.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, May 24, 2015 at 5:19 PM, Angel York <aniola at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I think one is going to be able to find non-profit organizations that
>>> choose to explore ways of distributing decision-making power and
>>> collectives & cooperatives that do not, and that it may not necessarily
>>> always be obvious which is which.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, May 23, 2015 at 9:34 AM, Joshua Hoffman <joshuahof at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Angel, et al.,
>>>>
>>>> I appreciate the distinction you make between *co-ops* and
>>>> *collectives.* It sounds like your shop is innovating with the power
>>>> relationships that surround decision making. I'm excited to see how you
>>>> grow.
>>>>
>>>> It's my understanding that capitalism is a firstly a description of our
>>>> social relationships, and secondly our economic system. Because it's not
>>>> just our economy but society itself that is capitalistic (in reality the
>>>> two are the same) living a true alternative is actually impossible. We
>>>> can aspire to take anti-capitalist actions by experimenting with new
>>>> non-hierarchical systems for the production/distribution of goods and
>>>> services. I'm interested in exploring those alternatives.
>>>>
>>>> To be clear, I don't think that hierarchical power structures are very
>>>> innovative. Which is why I'm less interested in traditional non-profits and
>>>> more interested in collectives and co-ops that may use a 501c status to
>>>> explore what's possible. As long as co-op are exploring ways of
>>>> distributing decision making power than I think they qualify for my
>>>> purposes. What do you think?
>>>>
>>>> What I want to avoid supporting are people using a 501c status to
>>>> "recycle" bikes for a personal profit (an astonishing number of people) I'm
>>>> also wary of the religious non-profits using bikes as an evangelical tool
>>>> (also a surprisingly large number).
>>>>
>>>> All that said, THE LIST is getting a lot of request from charities and
>>>> educational non-profits. It's difficult for me to know who is actually
>>>> innovating with social relationships and who is just filling a local
>>>> material need. Both are important. Suggestions?
>>>>
>>>> The votes so far:
>>>> Include ALL 501c bike related orgs - 6
>>>> Include only collectives, etc - 2
>>>>
>>>> - Joshua
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, May 21, 2015 at 7:11 PM, Angel York <aniola at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Joshua,
>>>>>
>>>>> Both of the bike collectives I have volunteered at are consensus-based
>>>>> organizations.  The Davis Bike Collective spent a year putting together its
>>>>> by-laws and running them past a lawyer to ensure that the board had no
>>>>> formal decision-making power, but was instead beholden to the decisions
>>>>> made by the core volunteers.  I believe the legal definition of a co-op has
>>>>> to do with purchasing power, where as a collective we didn't have to have
>>>>> that orientation and could instead focus on our priority, which was helping
>>>>> people learn how to fix bikes. Food co-ops are usually co-ops because they
>>>>> are about *buying* food. So I'm not sure that a co-op is actually less
>>>>> capitalist, and given what I hear you saying you value, I would be also
>>>>> asking how the various organizations are making their decisions.  Also,
>>>>> have you checked the wiki page of community bicycle organizations?  It has
>>>>> a long-standing list including the criteria that I believe more or less
>>>>> helps guide who might be interested in participating in, say, this list.
>>>>>
>>>>> The more lists the better! I look forward to thr day when there are so
>>>>> many lists of community bike organizations that you need lists of lists to
>>>>> keep track of them! Thanks for creating one such list!
>>>>>
>>>>> Angel York
>>>>> On May 21, 2015 1:17 PM, "Joshua Hoffman" <joshuahof at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks to Eric, Paul, Jeff, Kevin, and Matt for taking the time to
>>>>>> engage. Also thanks to everyone who shared new shops to add. I'll get on it
>>>>>> (that includes you Jeff). It turns out I was only subscribed to the "list"
>>>>>> email that arrives once a week so I missed a few of your replies.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The line is fine but its clear. I agree that cooperatives and
>>>>>> community shops are often different. I also agree that for-profit shops can
>>>>>> engage in so called "non-market" activities. My main criteria is DIY
>>>>>> (free/barter/cheap). If there is a second criteria it's a *free* EAB
>>>>>> program. My not-completely-arbitrary preferences in descending order are
>>>>>> cooperatives > community shops > service-oriented for-profit. That logic is
>>>>>> based on my assumption that orgs designed with cooperative structures will
>>>>>> find engaging in non-market behaviors easier. When we share the
>>>>>> risk/rewards of acting there is less incentive to shirk, pass important
>>>>>> ethical decisions "up the ladder", or use the "bottom line" as an excuse.
>>>>>> Yes, cooperative work can be messy and slow, but it can also liberate. For
>>>>>> many people their experience with a cooperative bike shop is the first time
>>>>>> in their lives when their voice mattered.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My reason for creating the list was to get new ideas for how people
>>>>>> doing community bike work engage with their communities. Shops that
>>>>>> focus on sales, or who use sales as their measure of success are going to
>>>>>> engage in a different manner that is less interesting to my aims. We
>>>>>> can start another thread on cooperatives if anyone wants. ;)  If
>>>>>> anyone wants to learn more about worker directed non-profits there is a
>>>>>> webinar next week.
>>>>>> <http://www.theselc.org/worker_self_directed_nonprofits_20150526>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> PLEASE NOTE: I'm getting most of my information by snooping through
>>>>>> websites and facebook pages. If I missed a shop or if I misunderstood what
>>>>>> a shops/orgs mission please correct me. I think Eric pointed out that
>>>>>> Uptown Bikes is for-profit (WB and Blackstone are both on the list). You
>>>>>> can leave a comment on this google.doc
>>>>>> <https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1S0FOc6ZJA-wYWo4qZ4yx75SBFq53aD8ELY1JGBt6UQY/edit?usp=sharing>
>>>>>> .
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - Joshua
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, May 21, 2015 at 12:01 PM, Joshua Hoffman <joshuahof at gmail.com
>>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Here is a searchable document
>>>>>>> <https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1S0FOc6ZJA-wYWo4qZ4yx75SBFq53aD8ELY1JGBt6UQY/edit?usp=sharing>
>>>>>>> if you want to check for your shop.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> NOTE: So far THE LIST
>>>>>>> <https://www.facebook.com/lists/792013340883812> only includes
>>>>>>> shops that run cooperatively or at very least include some DIY elements.
>>>>>>> I've done this for a specific reason.... I'm an anti-capitalist. I'm
>>>>>>> interested in how bikes build community and engage people in acts of
>>>>>>> cooperation and self-determination. There are many "non-profit" shops that
>>>>>>> sell used bikes for high prices because they believe it will "raise the
>>>>>>> perceived value" of bikes. There is nothing inherently wrong with this
>>>>>>> approach except that I'm not interested in money or perceived value. I'm
>>>>>>> interested in more people learning to do more things for themselves and for
>>>>>>> others. Cooperatives have the potential to lower costs by focusing on
>>>>>>> mission rather than profit. They can also transform the social
>>>>>>> relationships between humans by substituting hierarchy for equality. The
>>>>>>> benefits of encouraging DIY are obvious.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What do you all think? Should I include all "non-profit" bike shop
>>>>>>> regardless of their mission? What are the arguments for/against?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wed, May 20, 2015 at 6:52 PM, Joshua Hoffman <joshuahof at gmail.com
>>>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I've put together a Facebook list of all the community bike shops
>>>>>>>> who's pages I could find. 133 in total from around the world. This list is
>>>>>>>> constantly turning up amazing stories and new insights (lots of job
>>>>>>>> opportunities as well).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://www.facebook.com/lists/792013340883812
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Please let me know if I need to add other shops.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
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