[TheThinkTank] low end bikes, Invisible riders

Thu May 29 11:49:23 PDT 2008

arrrgh,  I can't remember why I joined this discussion now but one thing is
for certain, more people are commuting, and that's a good thing.  A
refurbished 10 year old trek mtn bike originally worth $350 will outlast a
Magna hands down.  These bikes are everywhere.  Yard sales, second hand
stores, neighborhood clean-up piles. . . you name it.   Perhaps just simply
tossing the Magnas as they arrive in the shop and focusing on acquiring more
"better" bikes is the solution;  if there really is a problem in the first
place.  At least steel from cheaper bikes could be contributed to the War
effort.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/23205249@N03/2400730147/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/23205249@N03/2400730143/<http://www.flickr.com/photos/23205249@N03/2400730143/in/photostream/>

On 5/29/08, Sherief <sgaber at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I wanted to jump back in here, perhaps because I think there's a lot of
> discussion going on and although the singlespeed v. geared debate may be a
> good one, I wanted to comment on what Kyle said.  Sure, a NEXT or Magna can
> last a long time when you overhaul it right out of the store, etc.  and i've
> seen people riding 10-20 year old department store bikes (irrespective of
> the fact that their quality keeps going down).  Nonetheless there is no
> intent by the "people" designing, marketing, and selling these bikes to do
> anything else than pocket a smug margin off a cheap bicycle that *will*end up in the trash pretty quick.  This is theft and exploitation.
>
> We need to work towards increasing the visibility and demand for
> inexpensive commuters.  Some solution can and should be made to provide an
> alternative within the price range of a department store bike that would
> clearly be better, and a way to make that difference accessible and known to
> the people who would be riding them.  Sure geared bikes are good, but
> Singlespeeds that hold up are better than a geared bike that will fail and
> won't be fixable.  We've had day laborers come into our shop before to do an
> earn-a-bike, and for everyone who tries to pick up an unservicable
> department store bike, we'll sit with them and talk to them and demonstrate
> the differences between that and a perhaps less shiny but sustainable
> alternative.
>
> Current environmentalism and bicycle greenwashing have proven to be a joke
> in this regard.  Shimano's *Coasting *initiative with Trek and whoever
> else is pumping out 'commuters' that fit only the gentrifying or suburban
> middle-class; Austin's recently witnessed the joke coffee-shop/shower
> facility/bike store called Mellow Johnny's where Mr. Armstrong's
> commuter-focus seems to include only one or two expensive commuters and some
> $6,000 road bikes.  I know bike collectives do a good job getting real
> commuters on real bicycles, but maybe there's something else that can be
> done with shops and manufacturers to provide bikes that fit the needs and
> income of those who most use them... The "invisible riders" and the rest of
> us.
>
> -sherief
>
>
> On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 1:00 PM, Chris Wells <re-cycles at rogers.com> wrote:
>
>> I am always surprised by the number of customers requesting a single
>> speed here in Ottawa. We aren't exactly mountainous but it is by no
>> means flat and personally I can't even get around on a 3spd. However
>> many seem to prefer and be perfectly happy with a 20-50 year old single
>> speed. As long as they are happy and riding then who are we to complain
>> or criticize?
>>
>> Chris
>>
>> PS I imagine most vintage single speeds stick to the downtown core and
>> avoid hills while I tend to commute 20+km and often don't have time to
>> explore ways around the hills.
>>
>> --- Michael Wolfe <gzuphoesdown at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > the only "crime" i see here is converting a bike into a single speed.
>> >  While
>> > such a ridiculous notion might be fine for bike messengers of days
>> > past
>> > who did see the benefit of it being cheap and stupid such that no one
>> > would
>> > ever consider stealing one, it's out of place for ordinary civilians.
>> >  Isn't
>> > the point to get bikes to ordinary people?  Most people, as children
>> > learned
>> > to ride bikes with gears which begs that even a child can see the
>> > benefit.
>> > Even as this discussion was going on yesterday a neighbor pulled up
>> > to his
>> > home with a 30 pack on the top tube of his Magna and then proceeded
>> > to
>> > shuttle a child off to another destination in the same manner.  The
>> > notion
>> > of a one gear bike to suffice for his daily activities would seem
>> > ludicrous
>> > to him for sure.   The bikes they have stay outside all night and
>> > never seem
>> > to disappear which seems to support the theory suggested yesterday.
>> > hmmmf.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On 5/29/08, kyle mckinley <bicirider at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > the biggest problems with the walmart bikes seem to be related to
>> > (a)
>> > > shifting and (b) weight. both of these are mitigated by turning the
>> > bike
>> > > into a single speed. The safest way to do this on the cheap is to
>> > take apart
>> > > the freewheel and only leave one gear (so that it won't shift up
>> > and break
>> > > the axel) and use just the middle chainring in front.
>> > > The shocks on magnas and the like usually don't have much travel,
>> > so it
>> > > seems to work pretty well to pull it off and replace it with an old
>> > rigid
>> > > fork from the boneyard (as opposed to "real" modern mountain bikes
>> > that
>> > > require a problemsolver rigid fork to not result in a dangerously
>> > steep
>> > > headtube angle).
>> > > I agree that it is a good idea to rehad these bikes. The problem
>> > for a lot
>> > > of orgs is that there isn't the room to store both the walmart
>> > bikes and the
>> > > older, nicer, communters and mountain bikes. And those old bikes
>> > are better
>> > > for the rider, and less of a nightmare to fix up.
>> > > Moreover, regarding this whole thread; I can appreciate the general
>> > sense
>> > > that it is important to help everyone feel good about zer
>> > bike--even if it
>> > > is from walmart--but I would still contend that by purposefully
>> > > manufacturing bikes that break immediately, and are super difficult
>> > to fix
>> > > when they break, these companies are perpetuating a crime against
>> > the
>> > > bicycle... a crime so vast that the only point of comparison is the
>> > > dasterdly deed of "carbon fiber".
>> > > Surely there is a way that we can learn to articulate a rejection
>> > of the
>> > > continued manufacture of these bikes (most of which, despite our
>> > best
>> > > efforts, head quickly to the landfill) without blaming our patrons
>> > for
>> > > buying them. How exactly we do that depends on the individual
>> > > interaction--and how busted the roadmaster actually is.
>> > > thanks-
>> > > kyle
>> > > On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 1:38 PM, james blesdoe
>> > <jamesbleds0e at yahoo.com>
>> > > wrote:
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >> At the Bicycle Kitchen we have started making the Wall Mart bikes
>> > work and
>> > >> placing them on the street.  We use we  them for training our
>> > volunteers
>> > >> and even though they are only fact similes of a real  bicycle i
>> > use a Murry
>> > >> for polo.
>> > >>
>> > >> One poor fellow, who's bike feel off the bus bike rack and front
>> > wheel
>> > >> mangled dragged his single speed coaster brake pin striped
>> > be-fendered Huffy
>> > >> to  our shop.  He said, "i have had (when offered a modern bike)
>> > those and
>> > >> they get stolen. I ride this everywhere. I have never had problems
>> > with it.
>> > >> i like it  and just want to keep it."  he lost the front fender
>> > and we found
>> > >> a new front wheel. cost him twenty bucks and he is back on the
>> > road.
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> Happy rollin
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> Jim
>> > >>
>> > >> *Michael Wolfe <gzuphoesdown at gmail.com>* wrote:
>> > >>
>> > >>  I like where the discussion is going on Low End Walmart bikes. To
>> > >> provide an interesting prospective, check out this article in
>> > Bicycling
>> > >> Magazine. It highlights a part of the cycling population that we
>> > not only
>> > >> fail to recognize, but often are oblivious to.  It's kind of long
>> > but a
>> > >> worthy read.
>> > >>
>> > >> http://www.bicycling.com/article/1,6610,s1-3-12-13639-1-P,00.html
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>> > >
>> > >
>> > > --
>> > > If an Easyrider rides easy, then a bicirider rides bicis
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