On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 5:48 AM, Kevin Dwyer <kevidwyer@gmail.com> wrote:

Excited to see the OPs crankin' it up! The discussion is worthy also, as evidenced by folks of different types and places on both sides of the divide.

One way to look at this is the difference between Equitable and Equal. Equitable analysis treats different people appropriately different. We wouldn't ask a friend with a handcycle to go ride single track. While Equal is a value and aspiration, we all know that people are born, raised and live in different circumstances. Acknowledging these differences and accommodating them allows everyone to rise to their fullest potential.

So, while we might desire to live in a post gender/racial/sectarian/sex preference world, the folks at OP seem to be making very real progress toward their potential by creating a space where they can address their needs. There is no doubt that bicycles (especially in North America) have and are largely the province of males. If male presence/dominance keeps some people from getting involved, let's not ask them to feel unsafe/unwelcome/unappreciated/etc. ...let's give them the support they say they need.

In my experience, Separatism is often a transitional strategy, giving people the time and supportive space to accumulate the skills, knowledge, culture and confidence to relate to the plural community. There is significant research on the success of separate space in education (gals and math achievement, for instance). While I doubt that the need for separate space will go away anytime soon, I'm sure that the folks at OP (and others similarly situated) would be feeling a bunch better if white males (and others) were quick to recognize and support their efforts. We'll all be better off with more people riding/maintaining their own bikes.

Thanks for using bikes to change the world!

Kevin

The Bicycle Collective

Salt Lake City

On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 3:29 AM, jonny b <jonny@goodlifebikes.ca> wrote:

Way to go Ovarian Psychos! It's great to hear the good news and I look
forward to hearing more about it.

... And I'm totally amazed/blown away that we're still having
conversations about the necessity of things like Ladies, Trans and
Sissies night. Our lil' shop (in redneck Calgary, Alberta) has seen
huge community benefits from similar safe spaces. A few people (white
dudes) have complained/not joined/etc over it and fuck'em - feminism's
a founding and explicit principle of our initiative and outshines any
dude's need to prove some shitty point. There's plenty of resources
for doubtful dudes to read through - people have already put the
effort into creating them, so it's easy to just have a few zines on
hand or invite people to look it up themselves!

Love from Jonny

PS. Can't wait to see Plan B!

On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 12:00 AM, Wendy Monroe <wendy.monroe@usermail.com> wrote:
> I agree, to me also, it makes more sense to identify as a human being and
> cyclist first.
>
> In my opinion, identity politics makes non useful distinctions between
> people… encourages divisiveness.
> We have a lot more in common with each other as human beings who ride bikes,
> than the superficial distinctions that may differentiate us such as skin
> color, whom we partner with, what gender clothes we might prefer to wear…
>
> Just a thought as a bike repairer in a multiethnic neighborhood in
> Amsterdam.
>
> Wendy Monroe
>
>
>
> On 04 Jan 2013, at 01:24, mfen651@aol.com wrote:
>
> Victor and all,
>
> I can not help but respond to this. Some of you will see my response as
> negative, others as offensive, and a very few, as honest, authentic, and
> right on.
>
> I'd like to try to soften all and any reactions for what is worth by sharing
> that I have spent fourteen years in offices, assemblies, workshops, courts,
> and other places, as a mediator listening (in many venues) to people
> "explain" themselves and their reason for their behaviors.
>
> I for one am tired of the labels minority, protected class, gender oppressed
> and a host of others that I am not going to waste yours, mine or anyone
> else's time listing.
>
> In today's world, where more is spent on defense than on homelessness, and
> even more is spent on political campaigns than on those who don't have food
> to eat, one doesn't have to look far to see the worlds priorities are
> somewhat misaligned.
>
> That said, I would no more supports an advocacy group that would call itself
> "The Ovarian Psychos" or "Plan B Ladies, Trans and Sissies". Those very
> names are offensive to me, let alone millions (I'd bet) that are
> theoretically described by those names or labels as they would be properly
> called.
>
> Perhaps the one label I wear proudly is that of cyclist. I ride with many,
> of all genders, races, cultures, and sexual preferences, as well as life
> style choices. Really, I could give a rats ass in you know where what
> anyone's choices are with regards to those labels. I care only that they
> like me, enjoy a ride, and off we go. This attitude has brought me new
> experiences, new friends, and best of all, new knowledge. Knowledge that
> reinforces my stance here.
>
> If we are to label one another in terms of gender preference, sexual
> preference or racial character, then we acknowledge that we have a bias...to
> that label or we would not accept it. If we do that, then we fan the fires
> of bias and conversely indicate our prejudice. If you are one, than you are
> the other, and then you become part of the problem, not part of the
> solution.
>
> I do not thing this matter belongs as a subset of cycling. Perhaps blended
> populations should be. Perhaps world peace should be. Perhaps feeding the
> world population should be. Perhaps exposing one or another group that seem
> underrepresented in cycling should be, but it should not be the other way
> around as you are advocating for.
>
> Cycling is for just about everyone, and at some point in time, if we can
> create the accessibility that we need to be focused on, if we can create the
> motivational messages that we should be focused on, if we can create the
> understanding that we should be focused on, then one day is might be
> everyone, rather than just about everyone.
>
> I can support or ask anyone to advocate or support what you are suggesting
> here, nor do I thing the subject line is fitting. This is not supportive of
> women, its supportive of a very unique and niche group of women, whom do not
> and should not enjoy the support of the majority of women. By adopting the
> label, name if you will they have, they demean the larger population of
> females in the world.
>
> Again, this is my thoughts based on a life time of promoting understanding
> and communication between all people of the planet and just hopefully,
> beyond.
>
> Happy New Year Everyone.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Matt Fenichel
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: mustafaa ali <ali.mustafaa@gmail.com>
> To: The Think Tank <thethinktank@lists.bikecollectives.org>
> Sent: Thu, Jan 3, 2013 6:40 pm
> Subject: Re: [TheThinkTank] Support women.
>
> On Dec 17, 2012 6:04 PM, "Plan B" <nolabikeproject@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hey Y'all,
>> As you may be aware, one of the overriding characteristics of Plan B, The
>> New Orleans Community Bike Project is our belief and constant practice of
>> “practical radicalism”. We believe that one of the most efficient and
>> practicable ways to espouse culture shift is by performing outreach and
>> enacting mutual social aid. We've learned this in a concise manner during
>> our history.
>> We made the original call for Bike!Bike! in 2004, a tradition that has
>> progressed into an enormous gathering that crosses borders and causes global
>> impact. We're proud to host Bike!Bike! X, the tenth gathering and conference
>> and hope to introduce new traditions by expanding programming and offering
>> more than ever before.
>> The Chainbreaker book, written by Shelley Jackson and Ethan Clark is
>> another one of Plan B's babies and it's publishing was a definite push for
>> DIY culture.
>> Due to the generosity of Working Bikes in Chicago, we have a regular
>> supply of raw materials and used bikes that we use to teach classes and
>> further our outreach. We have shared the bikes with new community bike
>> projects in Mississippi and Alabama and are eager to distribute more
>> regionally. We also use the sale of bikes to fund the space and special
>> projects like our recent trip to present at 5th Annual National Urban
>> Cycling Congress in Oaxaca, Mexico. We co-presented with representatives
>> from several other community bike initiatives from across the US in an
>> attempt to espouse more like-minded initiatives as a force of economic and
>> social justice throughout all of the Americas. Our presentation garnered a
>> lot of interest and we are working with several new initiatives throughout
>> Mexico in a support and advisory role. We know that outreach is working and
>> we expect a strong presence of Mexican allies at Bike!Bike! X.
>> One of the more exciting things that happened at Bike!Bike! 2012 was that
>> race was finally a real topic. Contributing factors were a combination of
>> workshops and the presence of more people of color at Bike!Bike! than ever
>> before. The Ovarian Psychos ( http://ovarianpsycos.com/about/ ) were an
>> impressive presence at the gathering and for the first time ever, an
>> organized group by and for women with a strong base of people of color
>> unified many within our group. These sisters don't mess around and they are
>> now committed to launching their own community bike space. Plan B Ladies,
>> Trans and Sissies night ( http://bikeproject.org/programs/ladies-trans-queer
>> ) has committed to help them accomplish this[ and ]that's why we're asking
>> for your support.
>> Our latest initiative is a little different and for the first time ever,
>> we're crowd-sourcing the funding. Our Ladies, Trans, and Sissies night
>> coordinators, Tracey and Alisha, are going from LA to L.A. to support the
>> OP's and bring them resources and materials. The reason I'm sending this out
>> to the ThinkTank and distributing this appeal far and wide (and hoping you
>> all do the same) is that I think for many of us this is an excellent
>> opportunity to contribute to a cause that is greater than any of us and
>> something that's always been prevalent in our discussions of social equity
>> within our milieu. Specifically, the topic is gender and gender oppression,
>> and no matter how much we discuss it at a conference or try to resolve it,
>> the bluntest truth is that the core of the hard work in achieving gender
>> equity is done by women, for women and while males can certainly be allies
>> and supporters, the best situation is to allow women to be self-determined
>> and invest in their own communities devoid of patriarchy and male voices.
>>
>> Won't you join us in supporting gender equity and social justice within
>> the realm of community bike projects? Even if it's $5, anything helps for
>> this important work to be done. The goal of $1000 is on the low side. We'd
>> love to be able to support them fiscally and provide several tools and plant
>> the seeds for this very important space to flourish and cause real change.
>>
>> Here's the link to the indiegogo page where you can read more about it.
>>
>> http://www.indiegogo.com/LTS2OPB
>>
>> I'll be happy to answer any questions in this thread. Please support if
>> you can and help spread the word.
>> Can't wait to see you all in October, 2013!
>>
>> All the best,
>>
>> --
>> Victor Pizarro
>> Project Organizer
>> Plan B, The New Orleans Community Bike Project
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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--
John Barrett
The Good Life Community Bicycle Shop / Two Wheel View / The Organic
Saskatoon & Iron Orchard
jonny@goodlifebikes.ca
403.619.2648

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