Re: [TheThinkTank] Kicked out of Bike!Bike!?!
It troubles me that anyone was kicked out of Bike! Bike! I hope that we can get an official explanation from the organizers, explaining their reasoning, because the story as told reveals nothing that would warrant banishment.
I myself have the dubious distinction of being kicked out of one Bike! Bike! 2019 session with the reason given that it was for women only. Evidently this was for cis women only, as nobody bothered to have a conversation with me about my gender identity. I also feel that if women want to improve the world they need to be willing to raise the consciousness of all through education.
Since I am venting, a relatively minor third thing along these lines that bothers me was when I was standing near the front of a newly-opened lunch line, when some woman loudly declared that all of the men were to go to the back. I get that gender discrimination is hurtful to those who may have experienced It, but what sense does it make to impose the same hurt in return, upon different people who are innocent of offense? The men in line obediently went to the back of the line, many with eye rolls, thinking that these women were ill-mannered or unable to fairly queue up and take their turn.
In the future, I would like everyone to treat everyone else with more courtesy and respect, without regard for gender, race, or former occupation.
—Gordon Hamachi
Announcements were made that *food would be served to women, trans, and gender non-binary folks first*, as is the rule for the group who were providing the food during Bike!Bike! 2019. They had forgotten to announce this on the first day of the conference. It would have been helpful if guidelines like these (any specific guidelines related to the spaces we were using in Tijuana) could have been communicated via email, the website, or the B!B! handbook for attendees.
Anyone attending Bike!Bike! should have a fair understanding of anti-oppression and ways that our community works to fight inequality. "Treating everyone the same" is not a way to change our systems of oppression. Creating greater access or exclusive access (like Women & Trans hours at our bike projects) is one step that can be taken to be inclusive and equitable.
There's lots of great writing available online and in your libraries if you are rolling your eyes at offences such as being put at the back of the lunch line while considering yourself to be an ally.
Ainsley (Toronto)
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 3:54 AM Gordon Hamachi gordon.hamachi@gmail.com wrote:
It troubles me that anyone was kicked out of Bike! Bike! I hope that we can get an official explanation from the organizers, explaining their reasoning, because the story as told reveals nothing that would warrant banishment.
I myself have the dubious distinction of being kicked out of one Bike! Bike! 2019 session with the reason given that it was for women only. Evidently this was for cis women only, as nobody bothered to have a conversation with me about my gender identity. I also feel that if women want to improve the world they need to be willing to raise the consciousness of all through education.
Since I am venting, a relatively minor third thing along these lines that bothers me was when I was standing near the front of a newly-opened lunch line, when some woman loudly declared that all of the men were to go to the back. I get that gender discrimination is hurtful to those who may have experienced It, but what sense does it make to impose the same hurt in return, upon different people who are innocent of offense? The men in line obediently went to the back of the line, many with eye rolls, thinking that these women were ill-mannered or unable to fairly queue up and take their turn.
In the future, I would like everyone to treat everyone else with more courtesy and respect, without regard for gender, race, or former occupation.
—Gordon Hamachi
The ThinkTank mailing List
Unsubscribe from this list here: http://lists.bikecollectives.org/options.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.or...
Anyone attending Bike!Bike! should have a fair understanding of
anti-oppression and ways that our community works to fight inequality.
But isn't this a poor assumption? I'm sure that many people have had or have a less-than-fair understanding of anti-oppression but still want to attend Bike!Bike! to hopefully improve that understanding (among other things).
Jason
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 7:58 AM Ainsley Naylor needleandthread@gmail.com wrote:
Announcements were made that *food would be served to women, trans, and gender non-binary folks first*, as is the rule for the group who were providing the food during Bike!Bike! 2019. They had forgotten to announce this on the first day of the conference. It would have been helpful if guidelines like these (any specific guidelines related to the spaces we were using in Tijuana) could have been communicated via email, the website, or the B!B! handbook for attendees.
Anyone attending Bike!Bike! should have a fair understanding of anti-oppression and ways that our community works to fight inequality. "Treating everyone the same" is not a way to change our systems of oppression. Creating greater access or exclusive access (like Women & Trans hours at our bike projects) is one step that can be taken to be inclusive and equitable.
There's lots of great writing available online and in your libraries if you are rolling your eyes at offences such as being put at the back of the lunch line while considering yourself to be an ally.
Ainsley (Toronto)
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 3:54 AM Gordon Hamachi gordon.hamachi@gmail.com wrote:
It troubles me that anyone was kicked out of Bike! Bike! I hope that we can get an official explanation from the organizers, explaining their reasoning, because the story as told reveals nothing that would warrant banishment.
I myself have the dubious distinction of being kicked out of one Bike! Bike! 2019 session with the reason given that it was for women only. Evidently this was for cis women only, as nobody bothered to have a conversation with me about my gender identity. I also feel that if women want to improve the world they need to be willing to raise the consciousness of all through education.
Since I am venting, a relatively minor third thing along these lines that bothers me was when I was standing near the front of a newly-opened lunch line, when some woman loudly declared that all of the men were to go to the back. I get that gender discrimination is hurtful to those who may have experienced It, but what sense does it make to impose the same hurt in return, upon different people who are innocent of offense? The men in line obediently went to the back of the line, many with eye rolls, thinking that these women were ill-mannered or unable to fairly queue up and take their turn.
In the future, I would like everyone to treat everyone else with more courtesy and respect, without regard for gender, race, or former occupation.
—Gordon Hamachi
The ThinkTank mailing List
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I don't know what happened with this specific individual to warrent them being asked to leave...but in response to the previous messages...
I must admit...what are your reasons for joining a / volunteering at a bicycle collective if it weren't to help underrepresented and/or oppressed individuals/groups? If your reasons are anything other than that maybe you are there for the wrong reasons...I don't think that is a poor assumption... (I also realize that people volunteer at collectives to learn mechanic skills for themselves so they can work on their own bikes...I don't think those people are attending B!B! and if they are I'd think someone from that collective would explain what this gathering is for/about)?..
I mean if you are attending bike!bike! but you're not looking to learn anything to bring back with you to share with your community there is some wrong- which means you're aware that the point of B!B! is to bring back knowledge to help people within your community back home...
I hope that makes sense...
Pertaining to the "go to the end of the line" -To quote a volunteer whom I was explaining why we were going to be having a monthly night for TFW/lgbtq+ folks and it not being exclusive and I took a deep breathe after he asked "but I just don't understand why I can't be there since they are allowed to come here any time we're open"...oh calm down.
I agree with Ainsley on this matter, --->"Treating everyone the same" is not a way to change our systems of oppression.
Judith
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 16, 2019, at 12:12 PM, Jason Moore moorepants@gmail.com wrote:
Anyone attending Bike!Bike! should have a fair understanding of anti-oppression and ways that our community works to fight inequality.
But isn't this a poor assumption? I'm sure that many people have had or have a less-than-fair understanding of anti-oppression but still want to attend Bike!Bike! to hopefully improve that understanding (among other things).
Jason
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 7:58 AM Ainsley Naylor needleandthread@gmail.com wrote: Announcements were made that food would be served to women, trans, and gender non-binary folks first, as is the rule for the group who were providing the food during Bike!Bike! 2019. They had forgotten to announce this on the first day of the conference. It would have been helpful if guidelines like these (any specific guidelines related to the spaces we were using in Tijuana) could have been communicated via email, the website, or the B!B! handbook for attendees.
Anyone attending Bike!Bike! should have a fair understanding of anti-oppression and ways that our community works to fight inequality. "Treating everyone the same" is not a way to change our systems of oppression. Creating greater access or exclusive access (like Women & Trans hours at our bike projects) is one step that can be taken to be inclusive and equitable.
There's lots of great writing available online and in your libraries if you are rolling your eyes at offences such as being put at the back of the lunch line while considering yourself to be an ally.
Ainsley (Toronto)
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 3:54 AM Gordon Hamachi gordon.hamachi@gmail.com wrote: It troubles me that anyone was kicked out of Bike! Bike! I hope that we can get an official explanation from the organizers, explaining their reasoning, because the story as told reveals nothing that would warrant banishment.
I myself have the dubious distinction of being kicked out of one Bike! Bike! 2019 session with the reason given that it was for women only. Evidently this was for cis women only, as nobody bothered to have a conversation with me about my gender identity. I also feel that if women want to improve the world they need to be willing to raise the consciousness of all through education.
Since I am venting, a relatively minor third thing along these lines that bothers me was when I was standing near the front of a newly-opened lunch line, when some woman loudly declared that all of the men were to go to the back. I get that gender discrimination is hurtful to those who may have experienced It, but what sense does it make to impose the same hurt in return, upon different people who are innocent of offense? The men in line obediently went to the back of the line, many with eye rolls, thinking that these women were ill-mannered or unable to fairly queue up and take their turn.
In the future, I would like everyone to treat everyone else with more courtesy and respect, without regard for gender, race, or former occupation.
—Gordon Hamachi
The ThinkTank mailing List
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Are you KIDDING me??? I did not attend and now I’m so glad I didn’t, because upon reading this email, I can undoubtedly see that a prime example of oppression and inequality was clearly exercised at the Bike!Bike! 2019! Persecution, maltreatment, racism, oppression, and inequality based on a person’s gender, race, or sexual orientation, is exactly what I see here. You “punished” someone based on their perceived gender. Being inclusive and equitable means what is done for one, is done for all. This is clearly not what was practiced at the event. Claiming to be anti-oppressive and saying one is fighting inequality, doesn’t make it so. It’s in the actions, not the words.
Kathleen (California)
From: Thethinktank thethinktank-bounces@lists.bikecollectives.org On Behalf Of Ainsley Naylor Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2019 7:58 AM To: The Think Tank thethinktank@lists.bikecollectives.org Subject: Re: [TheThinkTank] Kicked out of Bike!Bike!?!
Announcements were made that food would be served to women, trans, and gender non-binary folks first, as is the rule for the group who were providing the food during Bike!Bike! 2019. They had forgotten to announce this on the first day of the conference. It would have been helpful if guidelines like these (any specific guidelines related to the spaces we were using in Tijuana) could have been communicated via email, the website, or the B!B! handbook for attendees.
Anyone attending Bike!Bike! should have a fair understanding of anti-oppression and ways that our community works to fight inequality. "Treating everyone the same" is not a way to change our systems of oppression. Creating greater access or exclusive access (like Women & Trans hours at our bike projects) is one step that can be taken to be inclusive and equitable.
There's lots of great writing available online and in your libraries if you are rolling your eyes at offences such as being put at the back of the lunch line while considering yourself to be an ally.
Ainsley (Toronto)
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 3:54 AM Gordon Hamachi <gordon.hamachi@gmail.commailto:gordon.hamachi@gmail.com> wrote: It troubles me that anyone was kicked out of Bike! Bike! I hope that we can get an official explanation from the organizers, explaining their reasoning, because the story as told reveals nothing that would warrant banishment.
I myself have the dubious distinction of being kicked out of one Bike! Bike! 2019 session with the reason given that it was for women only. Evidently this was for cis women only, as nobody bothered to have a conversation with me about my gender identity. I also feel that if women want to improve the world they need to be willing to raise the consciousness of all through education.
Since I am venting, a relatively minor third thing along these lines that bothers me was when I was standing near the front of a newly-opened lunch line, when some woman loudly declared that all of the men were to go to the back. I get that gender discrimination is hurtful to those who may have experienced It, but what sense does it make to impose the same hurt in return, upon different people who are innocent of offense? The men in line obediently went to the back of the line, many with eye rolls, thinking that these women were ill-mannered or unable to fairly queue up and take their turn.
In the future, I would like everyone to treat everyone else with more courtesy and respect, without regard for gender, race, or former occupation.
—Gordon Hamachi
The ThinkTank mailing List
Unsubscribe from this list here: http://lists.bikecollectives.org/options.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.or...https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__lists.bikecollectives.org_options.cgi_thethinktank-2Dbikecollectives.org&d=DwMFaQ&c=B_W-eXUX249zycySS1AyzjABMeYirU1wvo9-GmMObjY&r=UbMgyupc9RomOJXJGGLrvaiGXQRf86SK7cSV3Civtvk&m=7n9Fen9hoy6IuRkA8lHt43fqoG9YeuzzXMizwrwO73k&s=BBplrbVRUWrpWMhyVVK8ulCsQIc_ITnNDircRiFuh5I&e=
The word of the day for this part of the discussion is EQUITY.
That makes sense for the learning experience at the food line, but I am not sure how Eric's former military experience and current employment as a commodities trader was justification for banning him from Bike!Bike!
Can someone who attended the event provide us with the full story?
-Jonathan
On 2019-10-16 13:38, Judith Feist wrote:
I don't know what happened with this specific individual to warrent them being asked to leave...but in response to the previous messages... I must admit...what are your reasons for joining a / volunteering at a bicycle collective if it weren't to help underrepresented and/or oppressed individuals/groups? If your reasons are anything other than that maybe you are there for the wrong reasons...I don't think that is a poor assumption... (I also realize that people volunteer at collectives to learn mechanic skills for themselves so they can work on their own bikes...I don't think those people are attending B!B! and if they are I'd think someone from that collective would explain what this gathering is for/about)?..
I mean if you are attending bike!bike! but you're not looking to learn anything to bring back with you to share with your community there is some wrong- which means you're aware that the point of B!B! is to bring back knowledge to help people within your community back home...
I hope that makes sense...
Pertaining to the "go to the end of the line" -To quote a volunteer whom I was explaining why we were going to be having a monthly night for TFW/lgbtq+ folks and it not being exclusive and I took a deep breathe after he asked "but I just don't understand why I can't be there since they are allowed to come here any time we're open"...oh calm down.
I agree with Ainsley on this matter, --->"Treating everyone the same" is not a way to change our systems of oppression.
Judith
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 16, 2019, at 12:12 PM, Jason Moore moorepants@gmail.com wrote:
Anyone attending Bike!Bike! should have a fair understanding of anti-oppression and ways that our community works to fight inequality.
But isn't this a poor assumption? I'm sure that many people have had or have a less-than-fair understanding of anti-oppression but still want to attend Bike!Bike! to hopefully improve that understanding (among other things).
Jason
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 7:58 AM Ainsley Naylor needleandthread@gmail.com wrote: Announcements were made that _FOOD WOULD BE SERVED TO WOMEN, TRANS, AND GENDER NON-BINARY FOLKS FIRST_, as is the rule for the group who were providing the food during Bike!Bike! 2019. They had forgotten to announce this on the first day of the conference. It would have been helpful if guidelines like these (any specific guidelines related to the spaces we were using in Tijuana) could have been communicated via email, the website, or the B!B! handbook for attendees.
Anyone attending Bike!Bike! should have a fair understanding of anti-oppression and ways that our community works to fight inequality. "Treating everyone the same" is not a way to change our systems of oppression. Creating greater access or exclusive access (like Women & Trans hours at our bike projects) is one step that can be taken to be inclusive and equitable.
There's lots of great writing available online and in your libraries if you are rolling your eyes at offences such as being put at the back of the lunch line while considering yourself to be an ally.
Ainsley (Toronto)
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 3:54 AM Gordon Hamachi gordon.hamachi@gmail.com wrote: It troubles me that anyone was kicked out of Bike! Bike! I hope that we can get an official explanation from the organizers, explaining their reasoning, because the story as told reveals nothing that would warrant banishment.
I myself have the dubious distinction of being kicked out of one Bike! Bike! 2019 session with the reason given that it was for women only. Evidently this was for cis women only, as nobody bothered to have a conversation with me about my gender identity. I also feel that if women want to improve the world they need to be willing to raise the consciousness of all through education.
Since I am venting, a relatively minor third thing along these lines that bothers me was when I was standing near the front of a newly-opened lunch line, when some woman loudly declared that all of the men were to go to the back. I get that gender discrimination is hurtful to those who may have experienced It, but what sense does it make to impose the same hurt in return, upon different people who are innocent of offense? The men in line obediently went to the back of the line, many with eye rolls, thinking that these women were ill-mannered or unable to fairly queue up and take their turn.
In the future, I would like everyone to treat everyone else with more courtesy and respect, without regard for gender, race, or former occupation.
--Gordon Hamachi ____________________________________
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Gordon: I'm sorry to hear you were kicked out of a talk. Did it happen to be this one below, or was it a different talk? (taken from program, which I have also attached)
CYCLING WITH OVERIOS: MESA DE DIáLOGO / ROUNDTABLE DISCUSSION (SPANGLISH) 12.10.19 / 16:30 - 18:30 / ENCLAVE CARACOL Welcome to our discussion. connect with badasses with ovaries who have traveled the world on two wheels, both alone and in groups. learn tips, tricks, tactics, and share experiences.
Regarding your issue with the queue:
"The men in line obediently went to the back of the line, many with eye
rolls, thinking that these women were ill-mannered or unable to fairly queue up and take their turn. "
I understand you are frustrated, but I was also in line, with several other men. I was quite happy to leave the line, did not see any eye rolls, and personally thought the women making the announcement were badass.
Re: Eric being kicked out, I'm also interested in knowing more for the sake of transparency. I had heard a rumor about it but nothing else.
As Evan pointed out earlier, there is a Safer Space Agreement on the website, which I have copy / pasted below, just for future reference and ease for those reading email: https://en.bikebike.org/policy/
*The Agreement*
- We enter with a commitment to mutual respect, mutual aid,
anti-oppression advocacy, conflict resolution, anti-violence, and community building.
- We respect everyone's names, gender pronouns, expressed identities
and experiences.
- We support the empowerment of each person and group.
- We commit to making spaces as accessible as possible; physically,
socially, and personally.
- We are peaceful and honest.
- We respect each others bodies and spaces.
- We commit to hearing each other and creating opportunities for all
voices to be heard.
- We accept a shared responsibility to hold ourselves and one another
accountable for these agreements’ intent.
- We encourage open minds and open hearts.
- We promote inclusive learning spaces and questions in the spirit of
personal growth.
*Why have a Safer Space Agreement?* In order to set a common ground, we state our shared beliefs and desires for the space which is Bike!Bike!. We rally around these ideas for inspiration and to ensure that if there is behaviour which does not make us feel safe, we have something to point to. By agreeing to a commitment of mutual respect, we hope that if conflict does arise, we will remember what we have agreed to, and act accordingly.
*How is it enforced?* The host city has the responsibility of mediating safer space issues. They will decide what constitutes a warning and what constitutes expulsion from the conference.
*Arlin Schaffel* *Bridge City Bicycle Co-op* http://bridgecitybicyclecoop.com facebook.com/bridgecitybicyclecoop/ twitter.com/the_bcbc
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 2:55 PM Jonathan Rosenbaum gnuser@gmail.com wrote:
The word of the day for this part of the discussion is *equity.*
That makes sense for the learning experience at the food line, but I am not sure how Eric's former military experience and current employment as a commodities trader was justification for banning him from Bike!Bike!
Can someone who attended the event provide us with the full story?
-Jonathan
On 2019-10-16 13:38, Judith Feist wrote:
I don't know what happened with this specific individual to warrent them being asked to leave...but in response to the previous messages...
I must admit...what are your reasons for joining a / volunteering at a bicycle collective if it weren't to help underrepresented and/or oppressed individuals/groups? If your reasons are anything other than that maybe you are there for the wrong reasons...I don't think that is a poor assumption... (I also realize that people volunteer at collectives to learn mechanic skills for themselves so they can work on their own bikes...I don't think those people are attending B!B! and if they are I'd think someone from that collective would explain what this gathering is for/about)?..
I mean if you are attending bike!bike! but you're not looking to learn anything to bring back with you to share with your community there is some wrong- which means you're aware that the point of B!B! is to bring back knowledge to help people within your community back home...
I hope that makes sense...
Pertaining to the "go to the end of the line" -To quote a volunteer whom I was explaining why we were going to be having a monthly night for TFW/lgbtq+ folks and it not being exclusive and I took a deep breathe after he asked "but I just don't understand why I can't be there since they are allowed to come here any time we're open"...oh calm down.
I agree with Ainsley on this matter, --->"Treating everyone the same" is not a way to change our systems of oppression.
Judith
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 16, 2019, at 12:12 PM, Jason Moore moorepants@gmail.com wrote:
Anyone attending Bike!Bike! should have a fair understanding of
anti-oppression and ways that our community works to fight inequality.
But isn't this a poor assumption? I'm sure that many people have had or have a less-than-fair understanding of anti-oppression but still want to attend Bike!Bike! to hopefully improve that understanding (among other things).
Jason
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 7:58 AM Ainsley Naylor needleandthread@gmail.com wrote:
Announcements were made that *food would be served to women, trans, and gender non-binary folks first*, as is the rule for the group who were providing the food during Bike!Bike! 2019. They had forgotten to announce this on the first day of the conference. It would have been helpful if guidelines like these (any specific guidelines related to the spaces we were using in Tijuana) could have been communicated via email, the website, or the B!B! handbook for attendees.
Anyone attending Bike!Bike! should have a fair understanding of anti-oppression and ways that our community works to fight inequality. "Treating everyone the same" is not a way to change our systems of oppression. Creating greater access or exclusive access (like Women & Trans hours at our bike projects) is one step that can be taken to be inclusive and equitable.
There's lots of great writing available online and in your libraries if you are rolling your eyes at offences such as being put at the back of the lunch line while considering yourself to be an ally.
Ainsley (Toronto)
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 3:54 AM Gordon Hamachi gordon.hamachi@gmail.com wrote:
It troubles me that anyone was kicked out of Bike! Bike! I hope that we can get an official explanation from the organizers, explaining their reasoning, because the story as told reveals nothing that would warrant banishment.
I myself have the dubious distinction of being kicked out of one Bike! Bike! 2019 session with the reason given that it was for women only. Evidently this was for cis women only, as nobody bothered to have a conversation with me about my gender identity. I also feel that if women want to improve the world they need to be willing to raise the consciousness of all through education.
Since I am venting, a relatively minor third thing along these lines that bothers me was when I was standing near the front of a newly-opened lunch line, when some woman loudly declared that all of the men were to go to the back. I get that gender discrimination is hurtful to those who may have experienced It, but what sense does it make to impose the same hurt in return, upon different people who are innocent of offense? The men in line obediently went to the back of the line, many with eye rolls, thinking that these women were ill-mannered or unable to fairly queue up and take their turn.
In the future, I would like everyone to treat everyone else with more courtesy and respect, without regard for gender, race, or former occupation.
—Gordon Hamachi
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Hola a todas! Esto es bastante interesante para nosotras que no pudimos ir a B!B! y a la vez no Este correo esta muy lejos de ser algo propositivo y que sume a las organizaciones, ni siquiera invita a compartir el conocimiento o previas experiencias para mejorar. Ambos problemas, a nuestro parecer, debieron de tratarse y resolverse en el evento y no esperar unos dias después, por via correo. Nos llama mucho la atención el tono en que nos hacen responsables del mundo de mierda en el que vivimos: " also feel that if women want to improve the world they need to be willing to raise the consciousness of all through education. " Y no, Gordon, las mujeres no tenemos ni es nuestra obligacionista de educar personas, esa es tu obligación. también nos llama mucho la atención que se enfatice "los modos" en que se les pidio a los hombres irse hacia atras En México violentan 7 mujeres por minuto no hablemos de las identidades cuir, trans y no binarias porque la violencia es aun peor ; el discurso facho y sin sustento de los hombres es que cuando salimos a marchar, cuando reclamamos y cuando nos defendemos lo hagamos "con buenos modos" y no hagamos destrozos porque no es "la manera"¿Realmente entiendes las discriminaciones de genero que vivimos? lo dudamos
Quiza en los próximos eventos las personas que no esten de acuerdo con como se hacen las cosas, por ejemplo el orden de servir la comida puedan acercarse con alguien a despejar sus dudas y sus inconformidades en lugar de mandar correos cargados de reclamos a una lista masiva de correos
R.
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 4:34 PM Arlin Schaffel < arlin@bridgecitybicyclecoop.com> wrote:
Gordon: I'm sorry to hear you were kicked out of a talk. Did it happen to be this one below, or was it a different talk? (taken from program, which I have also attached)
CYCLING WITH OVERIOS: MESA DE DIáLOGO / ROUNDTABLE DISCUSSION (SPANGLISH) 12.10.19 / 16:30 - 18:30 / ENCLAVE CARACOL Welcome to our discussion. connect with badasses with ovaries who have traveled the world on two wheels, both alone and in groups. learn tips, tricks, tactics, and share experiences.
Regarding your issue with the queue:
"The men in line obediently went to the back of the line, many with eye
rolls, thinking that these women were ill-mannered or unable to fairly queue up and take their turn. "
I understand you are frustrated, but I was also in line, with several other men. I was quite happy to leave the line, did not see any eye rolls, and personally thought the women making the announcement were badass.
Re: Eric being kicked out, I'm also interested in knowing more for the sake of transparency. I had heard a rumor about it but nothing else.
As Evan pointed out earlier, there is a Safer Space Agreement on the website, which I have copy / pasted below, just for future reference and ease for those reading email: https://en.bikebike.org/policy/
*The Agreement*
- We enter with a commitment to mutual respect, mutual aid,
anti-oppression advocacy, conflict resolution, anti-violence, and community building.
- We respect everyone's names, gender pronouns, expressed identities
and experiences.
- We support the empowerment of each person and group.
- We commit to making spaces as accessible as possible; physically,
socially, and personally.
- We are peaceful and honest.
- We respect each others bodies and spaces.
- We commit to hearing each other and creating opportunities for all
voices to be heard.
- We accept a shared responsibility to hold ourselves and one another
accountable for these agreements’ intent.
- We encourage open minds and open hearts.
- We promote inclusive learning spaces and questions in the spirit of
personal growth.
*Why have a Safer Space Agreement?* In order to set a common ground, we state our shared beliefs and desires for the space which is Bike!Bike!. We rally around these ideas for inspiration and to ensure that if there is behaviour which does not make us feel safe, we have something to point to. By agreeing to a commitment of mutual respect, we hope that if conflict does arise, we will remember what we have agreed to, and act accordingly.
*How is it enforced?* The host city has the responsibility of mediating safer space issues. They will decide what constitutes a warning and what constitutes expulsion from the conference.
*Arlin Schaffel* *Bridge City Bicycle Co-op* http://bridgecitybicyclecoop.com facebook.com/bridgecitybicyclecoop/ twitter.com/the_bcbc
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 2:55 PM Jonathan Rosenbaum gnuser@gmail.com wrote:
The word of the day for this part of the discussion is *equity.*
That makes sense for the learning experience at the food line, but I am not sure how Eric's former military experience and current employment as a commodities trader was justification for banning him from Bike!Bike!
Can someone who attended the event provide us with the full story?
-Jonathan
On 2019-10-16 13:38, Judith Feist wrote:
I don't know what happened with this specific individual to warrent them being asked to leave...but in response to the previous messages...
I must admit...what are your reasons for joining a / volunteering at a bicycle collective if it weren't to help underrepresented and/or oppressed individuals/groups? If your reasons are anything other than that maybe you are there for the wrong reasons...I don't think that is a poor assumption... (I also realize that people volunteer at collectives to learn mechanic skills for themselves so they can work on their own bikes...I don't think those people are attending B!B! and if they are I'd think someone from that collective would explain what this gathering is for/about)?..
I mean if you are attending bike!bike! but you're not looking to learn anything to bring back with you to share with your community there is some wrong- which means you're aware that the point of B!B! is to bring back knowledge to help people within your community back home...
I hope that makes sense...
Pertaining to the "go to the end of the line" -To quote a volunteer whom I was explaining why we were going to be having a monthly night for TFW/lgbtq+ folks and it not being exclusive and I took a deep breathe after he asked "but I just don't understand why I can't be there since they are allowed to come here any time we're open"...oh calm down.
I agree with Ainsley on this matter, --->"Treating everyone the same" is not a way to change our systems of oppression.
Judith
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 16, 2019, at 12:12 PM, Jason Moore moorepants@gmail.com wrote:
Anyone attending Bike!Bike! should have a fair understanding of
anti-oppression and ways that our community works to fight inequality.
But isn't this a poor assumption? I'm sure that many people have had or have a less-than-fair understanding of anti-oppression but still want to attend Bike!Bike! to hopefully improve that understanding (among other things).
Jason
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 7:58 AM Ainsley Naylor needleandthread@gmail.com wrote:
Announcements were made that *food would be served to women, trans, and gender non-binary folks first*, as is the rule for the group who were providing the food during Bike!Bike! 2019. They had forgotten to announce this on the first day of the conference. It would have been helpful if guidelines like these (any specific guidelines related to the spaces we were using in Tijuana) could have been communicated via email, the website, or the B!B! handbook for attendees.
Anyone attending Bike!Bike! should have a fair understanding of anti-oppression and ways that our community works to fight inequality. "Treating everyone the same" is not a way to change our systems of oppression. Creating greater access or exclusive access (like Women & Trans hours at our bike projects) is one step that can be taken to be inclusive and equitable.
There's lots of great writing available online and in your libraries if you are rolling your eyes at offences such as being put at the back of the lunch line while considering yourself to be an ally.
Ainsley (Toronto)
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 3:54 AM Gordon Hamachi gordon.hamachi@gmail.com wrote:
It troubles me that anyone was kicked out of Bike! Bike! I hope that we can get an official explanation from the organizers, explaining their reasoning, because the story as told reveals nothing that would warrant banishment.
I myself have the dubious distinction of being kicked out of one Bike! Bike! 2019 session with the reason given that it was for women only. Evidently this was for cis women only, as nobody bothered to have a conversation with me about my gender identity. I also feel that if women want to improve the world they need to be willing to raise the consciousness of all through education.
Since I am venting, a relatively minor third thing along these lines that bothers me was when I was standing near the front of a newly-opened lunch line, when some woman loudly declared that all of the men were to go to the back. I get that gender discrimination is hurtful to those who may have experienced It, but what sense does it make to impose the same hurt in return, upon different people who are innocent of offense? The men in line obediently went to the back of the line, many with eye rolls, thinking that these women were ill-mannered or unable to fairly queue up and take their turn.
In the future, I would like everyone to treat everyone else with more courtesy and respect, without regard for gender, race, or former occupation.
—Gordon Hamachi
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Muchas gracias R. y Tigre Bici para compartir su perspectiva. We also did not make it this year, but the conversations here are a bit disturbing to me. However, it is not uncommon that righteously indignant men and their allies are the loudest voices in the room (or mailing list). I hope/assume it's not representative of the whole. Nos vemos a DF por la próxima. Nik
On Thu, Oct 17, 2019 at 10:09 AM Tigre Bici bici.uanl@gmail.com wrote:
Hola a todas! Esto es bastante interesante para nosotras que no pudimos ir a B!B! y a la vez no Este correo esta muy lejos de ser algo propositivo y que sume a las organizaciones, ni siquiera invita a compartir el conocimiento o previas experiencias para mejorar. Ambos problemas, a nuestro parecer, debieron de tratarse y resolverse en el evento y no esperar unos dias después, por via correo. Nos llama mucho la atención el tono en que nos hacen responsables del mundo de mierda en el que vivimos: " also feel that if women want to improve the world they need to be willing to raise the consciousness of all through education. " Y no, Gordon, las mujeres no tenemos ni es nuestra obligacionista de educar personas, esa es tu obligación. también nos llama mucho la atención que se enfatice "los modos" en que se les pidio a los hombres irse hacia atras En México violentan 7 mujeres por minuto no hablemos de las identidades cuir, trans y no binarias porque la violencia es aun peor ; el discurso facho y sin sustento de los hombres es que cuando salimos a marchar, cuando reclamamos y cuando nos defendemos lo hagamos "con buenos modos" y no hagamos destrozos porque no es "la manera"¿Realmente entiendes las discriminaciones de genero que vivimos? lo dudamos
Quiza en los próximos eventos las personas que no esten de acuerdo con como se hacen las cosas, por ejemplo el orden de servir la comida puedan acercarse con alguien a despejar sus dudas y sus inconformidades en lugar de mandar correos cargados de reclamos a una lista masiva de correos
R.
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 4:34 PM Arlin Schaffel < arlin@bridgecitybicyclecoop.com> wrote:
Gordon: I'm sorry to hear you were kicked out of a talk. Did it happen to be this one below, or was it a different talk? (taken from program, which I have also attached)
CYCLING WITH OVERIOS: MESA DE DIáLOGO / ROUNDTABLE DISCUSSION (SPANGLISH) 12.10.19 / 16:30 - 18:30 / ENCLAVE CARACOL Welcome to our discussion. connect with badasses with ovaries who have traveled the world on two wheels, both alone and in groups. learn tips, tricks, tactics, and share experiences.
Regarding your issue with the queue:
"The men in line obediently went to the back of the line, many with eye
rolls, thinking that these women were ill-mannered or unable to fairly queue up and take their turn. "
I understand you are frustrated, but I was also in line, with several other men. I was quite happy to leave the line, did not see any eye rolls, and personally thought the women making the announcement were badass.
Re: Eric being kicked out, I'm also interested in knowing more for the sake of transparency. I had heard a rumor about it but nothing else.
As Evan pointed out earlier, there is a Safer Space Agreement on the website, which I have copy / pasted below, just for future reference and ease for those reading email: https://en.bikebike.org/policy/
*The Agreement*
- We enter with a commitment to mutual respect, mutual aid,
anti-oppression advocacy, conflict resolution, anti-violence, and community building.
- We respect everyone's names, gender pronouns, expressed identities
and experiences.
- We support the empowerment of each person and group.
- We commit to making spaces as accessible as possible; physically,
socially, and personally.
- We are peaceful and honest.
- We respect each others bodies and spaces.
- We commit to hearing each other and creating opportunities for all
voices to be heard.
- We accept a shared responsibility to hold ourselves and one
another accountable for these agreements’ intent.
- We encourage open minds and open hearts.
- We promote inclusive learning spaces and questions in the spirit
of personal growth.
*Why have a Safer Space Agreement?* In order to set a common ground, we state our shared beliefs and desires for the space which is Bike!Bike!. We rally around these ideas for inspiration and to ensure that if there is behaviour which does not make us feel safe, we have something to point to. By agreeing to a commitment of mutual respect, we hope that if conflict does arise, we will remember what we have agreed to, and act accordingly.
*How is it enforced?* The host city has the responsibility of mediating safer space issues. They will decide what constitutes a warning and what constitutes expulsion from the conference.
*Arlin Schaffel* *Bridge City Bicycle Co-op* http://bridgecitybicyclecoop.com facebook.com/bridgecitybicyclecoop/ twitter.com/the_bcbc
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 2:55 PM Jonathan Rosenbaum gnuser@gmail.com wrote:
The word of the day for this part of the discussion is *equity.*
That makes sense for the learning experience at the food line, but I am not sure how Eric's former military experience and current employment as a commodities trader was justification for banning him from Bike!Bike!
Can someone who attended the event provide us with the full story?
-Jonathan
On 2019-10-16 13:38, Judith Feist wrote:
I don't know what happened with this specific individual to warrent them being asked to leave...but in response to the previous messages...
I must admit...what are your reasons for joining a / volunteering at a bicycle collective if it weren't to help underrepresented and/or oppressed individuals/groups? If your reasons are anything other than that maybe you are there for the wrong reasons...I don't think that is a poor assumption... (I also realize that people volunteer at collectives to learn mechanic skills for themselves so they can work on their own bikes...I don't think those people are attending B!B! and if they are I'd think someone from that collective would explain what this gathering is for/about)?..
I mean if you are attending bike!bike! but you're not looking to learn anything to bring back with you to share with your community there is some wrong- which means you're aware that the point of B!B! is to bring back knowledge to help people within your community back home...
I hope that makes sense...
Pertaining to the "go to the end of the line" -To quote a volunteer whom I was explaining why we were going to be having a monthly night for TFW/lgbtq+ folks and it not being exclusive and I took a deep breathe after he asked "but I just don't understand why I can't be there since they are allowed to come here any time we're open"...oh calm down.
I agree with Ainsley on this matter, --->"Treating everyone the same" is not a way to change our systems of oppression.
Judith
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 16, 2019, at 12:12 PM, Jason Moore moorepants@gmail.com wrote:
Anyone attending Bike!Bike! should have a fair understanding of
anti-oppression and ways that our community works to fight inequality.
But isn't this a poor assumption? I'm sure that many people have had or have a less-than-fair understanding of anti-oppression but still want to attend Bike!Bike! to hopefully improve that understanding (among other things).
Jason
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 7:58 AM Ainsley Naylor < needleandthread@gmail.com> wrote:
Announcements were made that *food would be served to women, trans, and gender non-binary folks first*, as is the rule for the group who were providing the food during Bike!Bike! 2019. They had forgotten to announce this on the first day of the conference. It would have been helpful if guidelines like these (any specific guidelines related to the spaces we were using in Tijuana) could have been communicated via email, the website, or the B!B! handbook for attendees.
Anyone attending Bike!Bike! should have a fair understanding of anti-oppression and ways that our community works to fight inequality. "Treating everyone the same" is not a way to change our systems of oppression. Creating greater access or exclusive access (like Women & Trans hours at our bike projects) is one step that can be taken to be inclusive and equitable.
There's lots of great writing available online and in your libraries if you are rolling your eyes at offences such as being put at the back of the lunch line while considering yourself to be an ally.
Ainsley (Toronto)
On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 3:54 AM Gordon Hamachi < gordon.hamachi@gmail.com> wrote:
It troubles me that anyone was kicked out of Bike! Bike! I hope that we can get an official explanation from the organizers, explaining their reasoning, because the story as told reveals nothing that would warrant banishment.
I myself have the dubious distinction of being kicked out of one Bike! Bike! 2019 session with the reason given that it was for women only. Evidently this was for cis women only, as nobody bothered to have a conversation with me about my gender identity. I also feel that if women want to improve the world they need to be willing to raise the consciousness of all through education.
Since I am venting, a relatively minor third thing along these lines that bothers me was when I was standing near the front of a newly-opened lunch line, when some woman loudly declared that all of the men were to go to the back. I get that gender discrimination is hurtful to those who may have experienced It, but what sense does it make to impose the same hurt in return, upon different people who are innocent of offense? The men in line obediently went to the back of the line, many with eye rolls, thinking that these women were ill-mannered or unable to fairly queue up and take their turn.
In the future, I would like everyone to treat everyone else with more courtesy and respect, without regard for gender, race, or former occupation.
—Gordon Hamachi
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participants (9)
-
Ainsley Naylor -
Arlin Schaffel -
Bike Church Santa Cruz -
Gordon Hamachi -
Jason Moore -
Jonathan Rosenbaum -
Judith Feist -
Kathleen Marron -
Tigre Bici