Hey y'all,
I have been throwing around ideas about travel equity after our trip to Mexico. For me a citizen of the US it was easy to get down there and was very affordable. I started thinking about why that was, and how it doesn't apply to everybody. Below is some suggestions that I have come up with. Most of these suggestions would really be up to the BikeBike hosts (Detroit in 2016), but the travel fund could be something we could start easily with donations. It is a rough draft and I'm looking for feedback (there has only been 5 minutes of feedback so far). Most of these ideas would take a bit of work, but I think it would be worth it to allow as many people to participate in BikeBike as possible.
let me/us know what you think, erk
BikeBike Travel Equity:
Suggestions to Offset Inequitable Travel Cost and Barriers
Summary: In an aim to make BikeBike more inclusive we should help address travel inequities. Travel can be much harder/more expensive depending on what side of some imaginary lines a person was born on or what system they have to live in. We should encourage those with privilege to help those with less.
- Registration: registration fees should be very malleable. Folx that
can pay more should be encouraged to support folx that cannot.
a. For some participants the registration fee is very cheap for all the services provided, others it may be a large expense.
- Travel funds should be created ahead of time to help folx with
Visas/other travel expenses.
a. Donations or excess registration fees could create these funds.
b. Example of need: A Mexican Citizen needs to pay $300 USD just to apply for a visa to the USA. If they do not get approved they do not get the money back. For a US citizen with steady work this might not seem like a huge loss, but that works out to $5,100 MEX, which could be 3 or 4 times a person’s monthly housing cost.
- 3 meals (and snacks) a day at BikeBike.
a. Eatting out is by default expensive, but if you come from a country with an unfavorable currency exchange it is even more so. Even without that exchange, some people don’t have money to blow on a luxury like eating out.
b. This creates a bit more work, visiting BikeBikers should be encouraged to help cook and take any other loads off the hosts.
c. An alternative may be providing access to the kitchen when meals cannot be provided.
I really like this idea! Here are a couple of thoughts:
- I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have
been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference. Food was included. (I was really impressed by OSB conference; more details on the ways they focused on equity available if you're interested)
- I was able to attend a Bici! Bici! in Southern California once because
our bike collective paid the bus fare to travel for the only two people interested to travel all the way from Northern California. It was a great experience, and I still remember it years later.
- I have never been to Bike! Bike!, but I've attended a couple regional
Bici! Bici!s, because, in addition to the hardship of buying a ticket to a faraway place, I am a person who values being able to transport myself by bike, as I would expect some non-attendees are, and I have trouble getting past the environmental barrier of traveling such a long distance, even for what I know to be an amazing event with people I'd love to meet, see again, get to know, share with, learn from.
Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment.
Angel York
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 2:42 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey y'all,
I have been throwing around ideas about travel equity after our trip to Mexico. For me a citizen of the US it was easy to get down there and was very affordable. I started thinking about why that was, and how it doesn't apply to everybody. Below is some suggestions that I have come up with. Most of these suggestions would really be up to the BikeBike hosts (Detroit in 2016), but the travel fund could be something we could start easily with donations. It is a rough draft and I'm looking for feedback (there has only been 5 minutes of feedback so far). Most of these ideas would take a bit of work, but I think it would be worth it to allow as many people to participate in BikeBike as possible.
let me/us know what you think, erk
BikeBike Travel Equity:
Suggestions to Offset Inequitable Travel Cost and Barriers
Summary: In an aim to make BikeBike more inclusive we should help address travel inequities. Travel can be much harder/more expensive depending on what side of some imaginary lines a person was born on or what system they have to live in. We should encourage those with privilege to help those with less.
- Registration: registration fees should be very malleable. Folx that
can pay more should be encouraged to support folx that cannot.
a. For some participants the registration fee is very cheap for all the services provided, others it may be a large expense.
- Travel funds should be created ahead of time to help folx with
Visas/other travel expenses.
a. Donations or excess registration fees could create these funds.
b. Example of need: A Mexican Citizen needs to pay $300 USD just to apply for a visa to the USA. If they do not get approved they do not get the money back. For a US citizen with steady work this might not seem like a huge loss, but that works out to $5,100 MEX, which could be 3 or 4 times a person’s monthly housing cost.
- 3 meals (and snacks) a day at BikeBike.
a. Eatting out is by default expensive, but if you come from a country with an unfavorable currency exchange it is even more so. Even without that exchange, some people don’t have money to blow on a luxury like eating out.
b. This creates a bit more work, visiting BikeBikers should be encouraged to help cook and take any other loads off the hosts.
c. An alternative may be providing access to the kitchen when meals cannot be provided.
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Angel,
" I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference."
One thing I think we want to avoid is setting up a caste system of people who pay and people who volunteer (indentured servants). At BikeBike everyone should be volunteers, it's a conference of problem solvers, and we can all come together to make it happen. No one is making money, so it should be on the conference as a whole to take on the work. One of the main goals should be to help build something and leave the city and the collective in better shape than we found it.
"Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment"
I don't disagree with anything you said, and we may want to think about the environmental impact of people traveling from all over the country (BTW driving alone in a car <9 hours has less impact than flying on a full plane the same distance). I however have gone to a few B!B!SEs (South East) and it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models. Especially in a region that is still heavily segregated(I did miss the B!B!SE in Atlanta, so I'm sure it was much different there). With this I think it would really benefit folx from the South East to be exposed to ideas of the larger group. Especially the collectivism of Latin America. I would say we could plan on only going to the annual international B!B! if it is in your region, and save money for it for the years it is not. However I think that would rely on the schedule being done a couple years a head. With the life expectancy of Bike Collectives I don't think that is realistic. (If you are from the SE and disagree with me, please let me know. I'm sure folx are working for social justice everywhere.)
My org really doesn't have money to spend on sending volunteers anywhere. We are focused on youth, so if we had money it would probably go towards sending youth to the Youth Bike Summit (YBS) or sending our youth mountain bike team to a meet.
thanks for adding to the conversation, -erk
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 5:48 PM, Angel York aniola@gmail.com wrote:
I really like this idea! Here are a couple of thoughts:
- I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have
been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference. Food was included. (I was really impressed by OSB conference; more details on the ways they focused on equity available if you're interested)
- I was able to attend a Bici! Bici! in Southern California once because
our bike collective paid the bus fare to travel for the only two people interested to travel all the way from Northern California. It was a great experience, and I still remember it years later.
- I have never been to Bike! Bike!, but I've attended a couple regional
Bici! Bici!s, because, in addition to the hardship of buying a ticket to a faraway place, I am a person who values being able to transport myself by bike, as I would expect some non-attendees are, and I have trouble getting past the environmental barrier of traveling such a long distance, even for what I know to be an amazing event with people I'd love to meet, see again, get to know, share with, learn from.
Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment.
Angel York
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 2:42 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey y'all,
I have been throwing around ideas about travel equity after our trip to Mexico. For me a citizen of the US it was easy to get down there and was very affordable. I started thinking about why that was, and how it doesn't apply to everybody. Below is some suggestions that I have come up with. Most of these suggestions would really be up to the BikeBike hosts (Detroit in 2016), but the travel fund could be something we could start easily with donations. It is a rough draft and I'm looking for feedback (there has only been 5 minutes of feedback so far). Most of these ideas would take a bit of work, but I think it would be worth it to allow as many people to participate in BikeBike as possible.
let me/us know what you think, erk
BikeBike Travel Equity:
Suggestions to Offset Inequitable Travel Cost and Barriers
Summary: In an aim to make BikeBike more inclusive we should help address travel inequities. Travel can be much harder/more expensive depending on what side of some imaginary lines a person was born on or what system they have to live in. We should encourage those with privilege to help those with less.
- Registration: registration fees should be very malleable. Folx
that can pay more should be encouraged to support folx that cannot.
a. For some participants the registration fee is very cheap for all the services provided, others it may be a large expense.
- Travel funds should be created ahead of time to help folx with
Visas/other travel expenses.
a. Donations or excess registration fees could create these funds.
b. Example of need: A Mexican Citizen needs to pay $300 USD just to apply for a visa to the USA. If they do not get approved they do not get the money back. For a US citizen with steady work this might not seem like a huge loss, but that works out to $5,100 MEX, which could be 3 or 4 times a person’s monthly housing cost.
- 3 meals (and snacks) a day at BikeBike.
a. Eatting out is by default expensive, but if you come from a country with an unfavorable currency exchange it is even more so. Even without that exchange, some people don’t have money to blow on a luxury like eating out.
b. This creates a bit more work, visiting BikeBikers should be encouraged to help cook and take any other loads off the hosts.
c. An alternative may be providing access to the kitchen when meals cannot be provided.
The ThinkTank mailing List <a href=" http://lists.bikecollectives.org/options.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.org">Unsubscribe from this list</a>
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it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models.
Hey Erk. I don't think we've met, and I appreciate the discussion. In my experience, this is not accurate. I like the concept of addressing the inequitable access to the community. In terms of access to BikeBike, I think this has a lot of potential. Some brainstorming:
*Travel Grants (independent group)* Very conventional. Probably would need some kind of fiduciary body to manage, then you get into taking and evaluating applications. bleh. One advantage I guess would be that it would probably be the most consistent model.
*Travel Grants (from BikeBike!)* If the grants were connected to the bikebike conference itself, and was either a mandatory or optional part of the registration fee, that could be an effective fundraising effort. This might require a bit more lead-time in the BikeBike conference organization, though. Also, I don't know who that would work financially.
*Partner Shops* Two or more shops/collectives distant from each other get paired up, and they pool their resources to send/bring one or more from each team to the national conference. This could be cool b/c it is way more interpersonal and organic. Would need to watch out for this becoming a paternal 'adopt-a-shop' scenario. It would be better for similar shops (economically, constituents, mission) rather than one supporting the other. I like this idea in that it can lead to new attendees breaking out of the comfort zone of their team and interacting more with the broader community.
From the perspective of my shop (Broke Spoke, Lex KY), we'd probably find
plenty of support in either of those scenarios. We'd be more than happy to pay a fee that went to creating a more geographically diverse conference. If we had a partner shop, our community would get behind bringing us together for a conference as well.
-Andy
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 11:33 AM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Angel,
" I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference."
One thing I think we want to avoid is setting up a caste system of people who pay and people who volunteer (indentured servants). At BikeBike everyone should be volunteers, it's a conference of problem solvers, and we can all come together to make it happen. No one is making money, so it should be on the conference as a whole to take on the work. One of the main goals should be to help build something and leave the city and the collective in better shape than we found it.
"Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment"
I don't disagree with anything you said, and we may want to think about the environmental impact of people traveling from all over the country (BTW driving alone in a car <9 hours has less impact than flying on a full plane the same distance). I however have gone to a few B!B!SEs (South East) and it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models. Especially in a region that is still heavily segregated(I did miss the B!B!SE in Atlanta, so I'm sure it was much different there). With this I think it would really benefit folx from the South East to be exposed to ideas of the larger group. Especially the collectivism of Latin America. I would say we could plan on only going to the annual international B!B! if it is in your region, and save money for it for the years it is not. However I think that would rely on the schedule being done a couple years a head. With the life expectancy of Bike Collectives I don't think that is realistic. (If you are from the SE and disagree with me, please let me know. I'm sure folx are working for social justice everywhere.)
My org really doesn't have money to spend on sending volunteers anywhere. We are focused on youth, so if we had money it would probably go towards sending youth to the Youth Bike Summit (YBS) or sending our youth mountain bike team to a meet.
thanks for adding to the conversation, -erk
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 5:48 PM, Angel York aniola@gmail.com wrote:
I really like this idea! Here are a couple of thoughts:
- I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have
been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference. Food was included. (I was really impressed by OSB conference; more details on the ways they focused on equity available if you're interested)
- I was able to attend a Bici! Bici! in Southern California once because
our bike collective paid the bus fare to travel for the only two people interested to travel all the way from Northern California. It was a great experience, and I still remember it years later.
- I have never been to Bike! Bike!, but I've attended a couple regional
Bici! Bici!s, because, in addition to the hardship of buying a ticket to a faraway place, I am a person who values being able to transport myself by bike, as I would expect some non-attendees are, and I have trouble getting past the environmental barrier of traveling such a long distance, even for what I know to be an amazing event with people I'd love to meet, see again, get to know, share with, learn from.
Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment.
Angel York
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 2:42 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey y'all,
I have been throwing around ideas about travel equity after our trip to Mexico. For me a citizen of the US it was easy to get down there and was very affordable. I started thinking about why that was, and how it doesn't apply to everybody. Below is some suggestions that I have come up with. Most of these suggestions would really be up to the BikeBike hosts (Detroit in 2016), but the travel fund could be something we could start easily with donations. It is a rough draft and I'm looking for feedback (there has only been 5 minutes of feedback so far). Most of these ideas would take a bit of work, but I think it would be worth it to allow as many people to participate in BikeBike as possible.
let me/us know what you think, erk
BikeBike Travel Equity:
Suggestions to Offset Inequitable Travel Cost and Barriers
Summary: In an aim to make BikeBike more inclusive we should help address travel inequities. Travel can be much harder/more expensive depending on what side of some imaginary lines a person was born on or what system they have to live in. We should encourage those with privilege to help those with less.
- Registration: registration fees should be very malleable. Folx
that can pay more should be encouraged to support folx that cannot.
a. For some participants the registration fee is very cheap for all the services provided, others it may be a large expense.
- Travel funds should be created ahead of time to help folx with
Visas/other travel expenses.
a. Donations or excess registration fees could create these funds.
b. Example of need: A Mexican Citizen needs to pay $300 USD just to apply for a visa to the USA. If they do not get approved they do not get the money back. For a US citizen with steady work this might not seem like a huge loss, but that works out to $5,100 MEX, which could be 3 or 4 times a person’s monthly housing cost.
- 3 meals (and snacks) a day at BikeBike.
a. Eatting out is by default expensive, but if you come from a country with an unfavorable currency exchange it is even more so. Even without that exchange, some people don’t have money to blow on a luxury like eating out.
b. This creates a bit more work, visiting BikeBikers should be encouraged to help cook and take any other loads off the hosts.
c. An alternative may be providing access to the kitchen when meals cannot be provided.
The ThinkTank mailing List <a href=" http://lists.bikecollectives.org/options.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.org">Unsubscribe from this list</a>
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Partner coops seems interesting, twice the beaurcracy, half the fun? /smile
So I'm guessing people go to BikeBike to learn from other places and people, and from what I hear, to party. Maybe even to get away for a while, like a vacay.
The further you go, the more you might learn, but the environmental and costs go up, maybe exponentially.
Personally, I've not gotten to a BikeBike, mostly because of cost.
We have in DC area, the Bike Summit, for legislation in the US of A*****... I've mentioned to one coop the possibility of hosting a BikeBike in the DC area, maybe surrounding the Bike Summit, for those who prefer to get a little greasy, instead of policy wonks only... The Summit is expensive too, but has many more commercial interests, afaict, building infrastructure, manufacturers, lobbyists, professionals, etc... Combining some who would go to that, maybe synergistically might be interesting to consider, like doing errands, combining activities in a trip, saves in the long run, less back and forth, but personal energy management, conflicting interests (including money, attention, etc) might surface, perhaps badly.
Also in the DC area is a regional organization WABA (Washington Area Bicyclists Association) and the 5 or so coop like places, TheBikeHouse.org, PhoenixBikes.com community bike shop/mostly youth program, MountRainierBikeCoop (not sure exact web link, it changed, but easiliy search/google able), GearinUp (spelling) newish DC youth program, and VeloCityCoop.org, and maybe some startups, school/college clubs, etc... No velodrome, yet! (hoping frame building, Atomic Zombie like hacking bikes develops... even for track bikes instead of just fixies, tall bikes, etc /LeanOnTelephonePoleToStayUpRight)
CritMass has low attendence for a city, metropolis of this size, about 100 people per month, last I knew, basically when it was first Friday, not much after switching to Last Friday, or 4th Friday, I forget, and keep forgetting...)
Bike Share exists, but mostly for tourists... Heavy expensive bikes and lobbying to keep it that way, imnsho. It gets people biking, and I used the predecessor bike share before they upgraded to the current one. They have bike lights, dynohub, and stations in DC, Arlingtion VA Alexandria VA, and Maryland (? never seen, but don't see why they wouldn't),
Bike Film Festival Has been in DC, but stopped after 3+ years, much to my shagrin... Restarting that, and combining that with BikeBike might make a nice party environment. Environmental Film Festival and some other events, (coining Million Biker Ride?) might be good to partner with. If BikeBike is only 5 days, or a long weekend, adding the rest to make it a full week, might help. Bike Summt and Caucus is probably a week. Locals mostly only have a free ride to do photo ops with congress, afaict, but not done that... Cost prohibitive, and my tolerance of BS, an essential ingredient of politics, is probably rather low, but whatever (almost, IANAL and don't play one online, etc..)...
All this leads up to a money issue. Would the infrastructure exist to host a BikeBike around here?
WABA might be central, but likely has it's hand full anyway. As a fiscal agent, might hold funds and do disbursements, etc... As a mediator amongst the mostly competing coops and bike orgs, might help, but it is not without it's own biases. A membership org, some costs and volunteers can volunteer a certain number of hours for membership. Stuffing envelopes parties exist, iirc, and other events, mostly etoh involved are central, afaict..
MtRainierBikeCoop and Phoenix are probably the oldest of the coop/community bike shops, TBH and Velocity probably about the same age.
I've wandered between most of them, trying them for what they are good at, and leaving some that I can't get along with. They have their place, I hope to some day have one of my own... Sober, clean (drugs at least) and disability + poverty friendly, etc... Kids capabile but not over run with them, that adults have to change their behavior too much... Smurf rule is dififcult to adhere to after smashing ones fingers, knuckles with a tool, etc... Social and stimulus levels (autism like) managed friendly like... Natural light instead of florescents, air conditioning, out of too much sun, etc... Learning as much, if not more than telling, commerce and money based...
Anyways, I can't throw washington dc area into the hopper, I don't speak for such organizations, just been loitering so long...
As far as myself going to a BikeBike or a regional one, the once every 3-5 years is interesting, but hink of college students, who graduate before that period comes up. Volunteer say 4 years and not get to a big national/international event, just regionals...
My sleep is such that many couch surfing/ warm showers arrangements would not work, hosting, or visiting/ as a guest... Getting away from people, distractions and odd noises keeping me up, in unfamiliar areas would be an issue... Hotel expenses prohibitive, and that is one of the advantages of hosting, stay at home, but the extra work involved may be exhorbanent. Events aren't the greatest for me to try to organize, because I might melt down, with social stress, etc... Paid work as a disabled person, isn't possible. So your average ED position, is not happening. Requires major life change just to try to spend too much time on other people's issues, imo.
So what might work?
Savings, somehow. Volunteer work / sweat equity, for say a year and get a free trip to an annual regional. Local foods, grocery, GLUT like Food Coop, perhaps. Gleaning and other bike to a farm and get what can reasonably be saved, instead of wasted, also adds a trip to the country, and/or urban farms, learning about the fuel like options locally. Oranges are nice, apples get tiring, Maple Syrup great, but requires mountains and/or cold, Seafood fun, salmon great, lobster, if I'm not allergic, all these food things are local to some places, not others, and transporting food around the world to keep citrus flowing year round is difficult, environmentally unfriendly, etc, but eating meat, going vegan (can't, but interesting concept), all contribute to the costs involved in living, travelling and events... Also utility bikes, like on a touring list, carrying a surf board, tools, moving sofa's/ futons, camping gear, tables, flyers, chairs, shop stools, signage, etc somewhat logistically difficult. Hilly mountainous areas (colorado, appalachia, etc) might limit some getting around, for old guys/gals such as myself, not to mention some wheelchair bound disabled. (hey, they got wheels too, just not all inline)... Oxygen levels in high elevations, high plains, say arizona, might effect some breathing, moisture content, rainy seattle, or too sunny/ warm/ rock lobster sun exposure also interesting, one trip I could not adjust well to too much good weather, in cali... I needed my down / bad weather to be mood congruent... /smurk
So other groups have to fund poorer ones, should language (don't should on yourself, much less others) and some other issues with the redistribution of wealth, and lack thereof... Cycle of poverty is difficult, breaking out of it, disabled are basically vow of poverty, like religious orders, but commanded, instead of volunteered...
Motorcycle to a bicycle event, might be an option, getting a trailer/sidecar and bike rack in addition to combine and ride locally. Safe storage/ parking, and anti non meat motor sentiment would be a liekly issue, mostly with twenty somethings and below, older might understand what it is like to be huffing and puffing too much, feeling like it might kill one to do what used to be relativily easy. (even a century), which reminds me bike clubs, riding groups, potomac pedlars, ohbike, and others, black women bike, and others, might be good partners and sponsors...
Commercial bike shops and other for profit enterprises benefit in having tourism, afaict, large scale protests, might detract from the tax base in law enforcement and crowd control costs....
But I digress, hosting seems interesting, wonder if it will happen in dc in my lifetime... /cough /wheeze /SanfordAndSonLikeDrama /ByeWheezy, /etc
Ateending some BikeBike before taking on hosting probably required, as training, planning and other experiences...
Presenting might be interesting. Hosts probably have a standard, these are your host organizations and services they typically offer type base package developed. Even to be considered to be a BikeBike host city/ town... Schools, off season probably have some infrastructure allready in place. College towns, UVA Charlottesville, VA, UMD College Park, Georgetown, GeorgeMason, Arlington and Fairfax (15? miles out) plus Gallaudet, and UDC plus others, Catholic, American, universities, some probably host off season conferences and have lower cost hosting than your average hotel costs. Youth Hostels exist for tourists, Appalachian Trail type access for routes, GreenWay and chinatown type accepts bicycles on bus infractstructure might help too), Public transit options for bike on rail/train/ bus/ etc a necessity. Amtrak does a little, but needs more, IMO. C&O Canal and GAP rails to trails for getting to an event, back and commuting, say to free Hiker Biker Campsites for the primative camping people, and really green folks...
Bike building conferences would also be interesting.
So, I guess just thinking out loud. Maybe put on a wiki website for massive editing over time, not really even draft level, typing out loud...
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 7:56 PM, Andrew Shooner ashooner@gmail.com wrote:
it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that
are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models.
Hey Erk. I don't think we've met, and I appreciate the discussion. In my experience, this is not accurate. I like the concept of addressing the inequitable access to the community. In terms of access to BikeBike, I think this has a lot of potential. Some brainstorming:
*Travel Grants (independent group)* Very conventional. Probably would need some kind of fiduciary body to manage, then you get into taking and evaluating applications. bleh. One advantage I guess would be that it would probably be the most consistent model.
*Travel Grants (from BikeBike!)* If the grants were connected to the bikebike conference itself, and was either a mandatory or optional part of the registration fee, that could be an effective fundraising effort. This might require a bit more lead-time in the BikeBike conference organization, though. Also, I don't know who that would work financially.
*Partner Shops* Two or more shops/collectives distant from each other get paired up, and they pool their resources to send/bring one or more from each team to the national conference. This could be cool b/c it is way more interpersonal and organic. Would need to watch out for this becoming a paternal 'adopt-a-shop' scenario. It would be better for similar shops (economically, constituents, mission) rather than one supporting the other. I like this idea in that it can lead to new attendees breaking out of the comfort zone of their team and interacting more with the broader community.
From the perspective of my shop (Broke Spoke, Lex KY), we'd probably find plenty of support in either of those scenarios. We'd be more than happy to pay a fee that went to creating a more geographically diverse conference. If we had a partner shop, our community would get behind bringing us together for a conference as well.
-Andy
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 11:33 AM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Angel,
" I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference."
One thing I think we want to avoid is setting up a caste system of people who pay and people who volunteer (indentured servants). At BikeBike everyone should be volunteers, it's a conference of problem solvers, and we can all come together to make it happen. No one is making money, so it should be on the conference as a whole to take on the work. One of the main goals should be to help build something and leave the city and the collective in better shape than we found it.
"Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment"
I don't disagree with anything you said, and we may want to think about the environmental impact of people traveling from all over the country (BTW driving alone in a car <9 hours has less impact than flying on a full plane the same distance). I however have gone to a few B!B!SEs (South East) and it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models. Especially in a region that is still heavily segregated(I did miss the B!B!SE in Atlanta, so I'm sure it was much different there). With this I think it would really benefit folx from the South East to be exposed to ideas of the larger group. Especially the collectivism of Latin America. I would say we could plan on only going to the annual international B!B! if it is in your region, and save money for it for the years it is not. However I think that would rely on the schedule being done a couple years a head. With the life expectancy of Bike Collectives I don't think that is realistic. (If you are from the SE and disagree with me, please let me know. I'm sure folx are working for social justice everywhere.)
My org really doesn't have money to spend on sending volunteers anywhere. We are focused on youth, so if we had money it would probably go towards sending youth to the Youth Bike Summit (YBS) or sending our youth mountain bike team to a meet.
thanks for adding to the conversation, -erk
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 5:48 PM, Angel York aniola@gmail.com wrote:
I really like this idea! Here are a couple of thoughts:
- I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise
have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference. Food was included. (I was really impressed by OSB conference; more details on the ways they focused on equity available if you're interested)
- I was able to attend a Bici! Bici! in Southern California once because
our bike collective paid the bus fare to travel for the only two people interested to travel all the way from Northern California. It was a great experience, and I still remember it years later.
- I have never been to Bike! Bike!, but I've attended a couple regional
Bici! Bici!s, because, in addition to the hardship of buying a ticket to a faraway place, I am a person who values being able to transport myself by bike, as I would expect some non-attendees are, and I have trouble getting past the environmental barrier of traveling such a long distance, even for what I know to be an amazing event with people I'd love to meet, see again, get to know, share with, learn from.
Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment.
Angel York
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 2:42 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey y'all,
I have been throwing around ideas about travel equity after our trip to Mexico. For me a citizen of the US it was easy to get down there and was very affordable. I started thinking about why that was, and how it doesn't apply to everybody. Below is some suggestions that I have come up with. Most of these suggestions would really be up to the BikeBike hosts (Detroit in 2016), but the travel fund could be something we could start easily with donations. It is a rough draft and I'm looking for feedback (there has only been 5 minutes of feedback so far). Most of these ideas would take a bit of work, but I think it would be worth it to allow as many people to participate in BikeBike as possible.
let me/us know what you think, erk
BikeBike Travel Equity:
Suggestions to Offset Inequitable Travel Cost and Barriers
Summary: In an aim to make BikeBike more inclusive we should help address travel inequities. Travel can be much harder/more expensive depending on what side of some imaginary lines a person was born on or what system they have to live in. We should encourage those with privilege to help those with less.
- Registration: registration fees should be very malleable. Folx
that can pay more should be encouraged to support folx that cannot.
a. For some participants the registration fee is very cheap for all the services provided, others it may be a large expense.
- Travel funds should be created ahead of time to help folx with
Visas/other travel expenses.
a. Donations or excess registration fees could create these funds.
b. Example of need: A Mexican Citizen needs to pay $300 USD just to apply for a visa to the USA. If they do not get approved they do not get the money back. For a US citizen with steady work this might not seem like a huge loss, but that works out to $5,100 MEX, which could be 3 or 4 times a person’s monthly housing cost.
- 3 meals (and snacks) a day at BikeBike.
a. Eatting out is by default expensive, but if you come from a country with an unfavorable currency exchange it is even more so. Even without that exchange, some people don’t have money to blow on a luxury like eating out.
b. This creates a bit more work, visiting BikeBikers should be encouraged to help cook and take any other loads off the hosts.
c. An alternative may be providing access to the kitchen when meals cannot be provided.
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I like the idea of regional conferences to make them more accessible. As DancesWithCars points out, there is a group of community shops in the DC metro area that could easily support something like this. In fact, in addition to the 5 that Dances.. mentions, there is my group, The Rockvile Bike Hub, which just started this past season in Rockville, MD, so there is now representation in Montgomery County Maryland.
Other areas might have to include larger geographic areas to find enough people and support, but it would still be more affordable overall.
Steve Andruski
On Mon, Oct 12, 2015 at 9:08 AM, DancesWithCars danceswithcars@gmail.com wrote:
Partner coops seems interesting, twice the beaurcracy, half the fun? /smile
So I'm guessing people go to BikeBike to learn from other places and people, and from what I hear, to party. Maybe even to get away for a while, like a vacay.
The further you go, the more you might learn, but the environmental and costs go up, maybe exponentially.
Personally, I've not gotten to a BikeBike, mostly because of cost.
We have in DC area, the Bike Summit, for legislation in the US of A*****... I've mentioned to one coop the possibility of hosting a BikeBike in the DC area, maybe surrounding the Bike Summit, for those who prefer to get a little greasy, instead of policy wonks only... The Summit is expensive too, but has many more commercial interests, afaict, building infrastructure, manufacturers, lobbyists, professionals, etc... Combining some who would go to that, maybe synergistically might be interesting to consider, like doing errands, combining activities in a trip, saves in the long run, less back and forth, but personal energy management, conflicting interests (including money, attention, etc) might surface, perhaps badly.
Also in the DC area is a regional organization WABA (Washington Area Bicyclists Association) and the 5 or so coop like places, TheBikeHouse.org, PhoenixBikes.com community bike shop/mostly youth program, MountRainierBikeCoop (not sure exact web link, it changed, but easiliy search/google able), GearinUp (spelling) newish DC youth program, and VeloCityCoop.org, and maybe some startups, school/college clubs, etc... No velodrome, yet! (hoping frame building, Atomic Zombie like hacking bikes develops... even for track bikes instead of just fixies, tall bikes, etc /LeanOnTelephonePoleToStayUpRight)
CritMass has low attendence for a city, metropolis of this size, about 100 people per month, last I knew, basically when it was first Friday, not much after switching to Last Friday, or 4th Friday, I forget, and keep forgetting...)
Bike Share exists, but mostly for tourists... Heavy expensive bikes and lobbying to keep it that way, imnsho. It gets people biking, and I used the predecessor bike share before they upgraded to the current one. They have bike lights, dynohub, and stations in DC, Arlingtion VA Alexandria VA, and Maryland (? never seen, but don't see why they wouldn't),
Bike Film Festival Has been in DC, but stopped after 3+ years, much to my shagrin... Restarting that, and combining that with BikeBike might make a nice party environment. Environmental Film Festival and some other events, (coining Million Biker Ride?) might be good to partner with. If BikeBike is only 5 days, or a long weekend, adding the rest to make it a full week, might help. Bike Summt and Caucus is probably a week. Locals mostly only have a free ride to do photo ops with congress, afaict, but not done that... Cost prohibitive, and my tolerance of BS, an essential ingredient of politics, is probably rather low, but whatever (almost, IANAL and don't play one online, etc..)...
All this leads up to a money issue. Would the infrastructure exist to host a BikeBike around here?
WABA might be central, but likely has it's hand full anyway. As a fiscal agent, might hold funds and do disbursements, etc... As a mediator amongst the mostly competing coops and bike orgs, might help, but it is not without it's own biases. A membership org, some costs and volunteers can volunteer a certain number of hours for membership. Stuffing envelopes parties exist, iirc, and other events, mostly etoh involved are central, afaict..
MtRainierBikeCoop and Phoenix are probably the oldest of the coop/community bike shops, TBH and Velocity probably about the same age.
I've wandered between most of them, trying them for what they are good at, and leaving some that I can't get along with. They have their place, I hope to some day have one of my own... Sober, clean (drugs at least) and disability + poverty friendly, etc... Kids capabile but not over run with them, that adults have to change their behavior too much... Smurf rule is dififcult to adhere to after smashing ones fingers, knuckles with a tool, etc... Social and stimulus levels (autism like) managed friendly like... Natural light instead of florescents, air conditioning, out of too much sun, etc... Learning as much, if not more than telling, commerce and money based...
Anyways, I can't throw washington dc area into the hopper, I don't speak for such organizations, just been loitering so long...
As far as myself going to a BikeBike or a regional one, the once every 3-5 years is interesting, but hink of college students, who graduate before that period comes up. Volunteer say 4 years and not get to a big national/international event, just regionals...
My sleep is such that many couch surfing/ warm showers arrangements would not work, hosting, or visiting/ as a guest... Getting away from people, distractions and odd noises keeping me up, in unfamiliar areas would be an issue... Hotel expenses prohibitive, and that is one of the advantages of hosting, stay at home, but the extra work involved may be exhorbanent. Events aren't the greatest for me to try to organize, because I might melt down, with social stress, etc... Paid work as a disabled person, isn't possible. So your average ED position, is not happening. Requires major life change just to try to spend too much time on other people's issues, imo.
So what might work?
Savings, somehow. Volunteer work / sweat equity, for say a year and get a free trip to an annual regional. Local foods, grocery, GLUT like Food Coop, perhaps. Gleaning and other bike to a farm and get what can reasonably be saved, instead of wasted, also adds a trip to the country, and/or urban farms, learning about the fuel like options locally. Oranges are nice, apples get tiring, Maple Syrup great, but requires mountains and/or cold, Seafood fun, salmon great, lobster, if I'm not allergic, all these food things are local to some places, not others, and transporting food around the world to keep citrus flowing year round is difficult, environmentally unfriendly, etc, but eating meat, going vegan (can't, but interesting concept), all contribute to the costs involved in living, travelling and events... Also utility bikes, like on a touring list, carrying a surf board, tools, moving sofa's/ futons, camping gear, tables, flyers, chairs, shop stools, signage, etc somewhat logistically difficult. Hilly mountainous areas (colorado, appalachia, etc) might limit some getting around, for old guys/gals such as myself, not to mention some wheelchair bound disabled. (hey, they got wheels too, just not all inline)... Oxygen levels in high elevations, high plains, say arizona, might effect some breathing, moisture content, rainy seattle, or too sunny/ warm/ rock lobster sun exposure also interesting, one trip I could not adjust well to too much good weather, in cali... I needed my down / bad weather to be mood congruent... /smurk
So other groups have to fund poorer ones, should language (don't should on yourself, much less others) and some other issues with the redistribution of wealth, and lack thereof... Cycle of poverty is difficult, breaking out of it, disabled are basically vow of poverty, like religious orders, but commanded, instead of volunteered...
Motorcycle to a bicycle event, might be an option, getting a trailer/sidecar and bike rack in addition to combine and ride locally. Safe storage/ parking, and anti non meat motor sentiment would be a liekly issue, mostly with twenty somethings and below, older might understand what it is like to be huffing and puffing too much, feeling like it might kill one to do what used to be relativily easy. (even a century), which reminds me bike clubs, riding groups, potomac pedlars, ohbike, and others, black women bike, and others, might be good partners and sponsors...
Commercial bike shops and other for profit enterprises benefit in having tourism, afaict, large scale protests, might detract from the tax base in law enforcement and crowd control costs....
But I digress, hosting seems interesting, wonder if it will happen in dc in my lifetime... /cough /wheeze /SanfordAndSonLikeDrama /ByeWheezy, /etc
Ateending some BikeBike before taking on hosting probably required, as training, planning and other experiences...
Presenting might be interesting. Hosts probably have a standard, these are your host organizations and services they typically offer type base package developed. Even to be considered to be a BikeBike host city/ town... Schools, off season probably have some infrastructure allready in place. College towns, UVA Charlottesville, VA, UMD College Park, Georgetown, GeorgeMason, Arlington and Fairfax (15? miles out) plus Gallaudet, and UDC plus others, Catholic, American, universities, some probably host off season conferences and have lower cost hosting than your average hotel costs. Youth Hostels exist for tourists, Appalachian Trail type access for routes, GreenWay and chinatown type accepts bicycles on bus infractstructure might help too), Public transit options for bike on rail/train/ bus/ etc a necessity. Amtrak does a little, but needs more, IMO. C&O Canal and GAP rails to trails for getting to an event, back and commuting, say to free Hiker Biker Campsites for the primative camping people, and really green folks...
Bike building conferences would also be interesting.
So, I guess just thinking out loud. Maybe put on a wiki website for massive editing over time, not really even draft level, typing out loud...
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 7:56 PM, Andrew Shooner ashooner@gmail.com wrote:
it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops
that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models.
Hey Erk. I don't think we've met, and I appreciate the discussion. In my experience, this is not accurate. I like the concept of addressing the inequitable access to the community. In terms of access to BikeBike, I think this has a lot of potential. Some brainstorming:
*Travel Grants (independent group)* Very conventional. Probably would need some kind of fiduciary body to manage, then you get into taking and evaluating applications. bleh. One advantage I guess would be that it would probably be the most consistent model.
*Travel Grants (from BikeBike!)* If the grants were connected to the bikebike conference itself, and was either a mandatory or optional part of the registration fee, that could be an effective fundraising effort. This might require a bit more lead-time in the BikeBike conference organization, though. Also, I don't know who that would work financially.
*Partner Shops* Two or more shops/collectives distant from each other get paired up, and they pool their resources to send/bring one or more from each team to the national conference. This could be cool b/c it is way more interpersonal and organic. Would need to watch out for this becoming a paternal 'adopt-a-shop' scenario. It would be better for similar shops (economically, constituents, mission) rather than one supporting the other. I like this idea in that it can lead to new attendees breaking out of the comfort zone of their team and interacting more with the broader community.
From the perspective of my shop (Broke Spoke, Lex KY), we'd probably find plenty of support in either of those scenarios. We'd be more than happy to pay a fee that went to creating a more geographically diverse conference. If we had a partner shop, our community would get behind bringing us together for a conference as well.
-Andy
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 11:33 AM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Angel,
" I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference."
One thing I think we want to avoid is setting up a caste system of people who pay and people who volunteer (indentured servants). At BikeBike everyone should be volunteers, it's a conference of problem solvers, and we can all come together to make it happen. No one is making money, so it should be on the conference as a whole to take on the work. One of the main goals should be to help build something and leave the city and the collective in better shape than we found it.
"Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment"
I don't disagree with anything you said, and we may want to think about the environmental impact of people traveling from all over the country (BTW driving alone in a car <9 hours has less impact than flying on a full plane the same distance). I however have gone to a few B!B!SEs (South East) and it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models. Especially in a region that is still heavily segregated(I did miss the B!B!SE in Atlanta, so I'm sure it was much different there). With this I think it would really benefit folx from the South East to be exposed to ideas of the larger group. Especially the collectivism of Latin America. I would say we could plan on only going to the annual international B!B! if it is in your region, and save money for it for the years it is not. However I think that would rely on the schedule being done a couple years a head. With the life expectancy of Bike Collectives I don't think that is realistic. (If you are from the SE and disagree with me, please let me know. I'm sure folx are working for social justice everywhere.)
My org really doesn't have money to spend on sending volunteers anywhere. We are focused on youth, so if we had money it would probably go towards sending youth to the Youth Bike Summit (YBS) or sending our youth mountain bike team to a meet.
thanks for adding to the conversation, -erk
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 5:48 PM, Angel York aniola@gmail.com wrote:
I really like this idea! Here are a couple of thoughts:
- I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise
have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference. Food was included. (I was really impressed by OSB conference; more details on the ways they focused on equity available if you're interested)
- I was able to attend a Bici! Bici! in Southern California once
because our bike collective paid the bus fare to travel for the only two people interested to travel all the way from Northern California. It was a great experience, and I still remember it years later.
- I have never been to Bike! Bike!, but I've attended a couple regional
Bici! Bici!s, because, in addition to the hardship of buying a ticket to a faraway place, I am a person who values being able to transport myself by bike, as I would expect some non-attendees are, and I have trouble getting past the environmental barrier of traveling such a long distance, even for what I know to be an amazing event with people I'd love to meet, see again, get to know, share with, learn from.
Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment.
Angel York
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 2:42 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey y'all,
I have been throwing around ideas about travel equity after our trip to Mexico. For me a citizen of the US it was easy to get down there and was very affordable. I started thinking about why that was, and how it doesn't apply to everybody. Below is some suggestions that I have come up with. Most of these suggestions would really be up to the BikeBike hosts (Detroit in 2016), but the travel fund could be something we could start easily with donations. It is a rough draft and I'm looking for feedback (there has only been 5 minutes of feedback so far). Most of these ideas would take a bit of work, but I think it would be worth it to allow as many people to participate in BikeBike as possible.
let me/us know what you think, erk
BikeBike Travel Equity:
Suggestions to Offset Inequitable Travel Cost and Barriers
Summary: In an aim to make BikeBike more inclusive we should help address travel inequities. Travel can be much harder/more expensive depending on what side of some imaginary lines a person was born on or what system they have to live in. We should encourage those with privilege to help those with less.
- Registration: registration fees should be very malleable. Folx
that can pay more should be encouraged to support folx that cannot.
a. For some participants the registration fee is very cheap for all the services provided, others it may be a large expense.
- Travel funds should be created ahead of time to help folx with
Visas/other travel expenses.
a. Donations or excess registration fees could create these funds.
b. Example of need: A Mexican Citizen needs to pay $300 USD just to apply for a visa to the USA. If they do not get approved they do not get the money back. For a US citizen with steady work this might not seem like a huge loss, but that works out to $5,100 MEX, which could be 3 or 4 times a person’s monthly housing cost.
- 3 meals (and snacks) a day at BikeBike.
a. Eatting out is by default expensive, but if you come from a country with an unfavorable currency exchange it is even more so. Even without that exchange, some people don’t have money to blow on a luxury like eating out.
b. This creates a bit more work, visiting BikeBikers should be encouraged to help cook and take any other loads off the hosts.
c. An alternative may be providing access to the kitchen when meals cannot be provided.
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-- DancesWithCars leave the wolves behind ;-)
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Let me add my 2 cents for the first time on this forum . I work for the city of Albuquerque and am responsible for a bike safety education program that travel to many different school districts and a bike safety education center that has a community bike component. I have always wanted to go to Bike Bike for many years and am planning to go to Detroit as my vacation next year.
The City of Albuquerque does have funding and when Bike Bike came around to New Orleans I tried many times to get the organizers to charge me a conference fee and provide me with an itinerary so that I could attend. This was not something they could provide and hence I was unable to go. People who can pay to attend Bike Bike could offset the cost of people that cannot afford to go. I would also be happy to donate to a travel fund that the organizer would have to monitor and prioritize.
Chuck Malagodi Outdoor Recreation Coordinator 1801 Fourth St. NW, Buliding A Albuquerque, NM 87102 505-768-BIKE (2453) Cmalagodi@cabq.gov
From: Thethinktank [mailto:thethinktank-bounces@lists.bikecollectives.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Shooner Sent: Sunday, October 11, 2015 5:57 PM To: The Think Tank Subject: Re: [TheThinkTank] Travel Equity for BikeBike
it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models.
Hey Erk. I don't think we've met, and I appreciate the discussion. In my experience, this is not accurate. I like the concept of addressing the inequitable access to the community. In terms of access to BikeBike, I think this has a lot of potential. Some brainstorming:
Travel Grants (independent group) Very conventional. Probably would need some kind of fiduciary body to manage, then you get into taking and evaluating applications. bleh. One advantage I guess would be that it would probably be the most consistent model.
Travel Grants (from BikeBike!) If the grants were connected to the bikebike conference itself, and was either a mandatory or optional part of the registration fee, that could be an effective fundraising effort. This might require a bit more lead-time in the BikeBike conference organization, though. Also, I don't know who that would work financially.
Partner Shops Two or more shops/collectives distant from each other get paired up, and they pool their resources to send/bring one or more from each team to the national conference. This could be cool b/c it is way more interpersonal and organic. Would need to watch out for this becoming a paternal 'adopt-a-shop' scenario. It would be better for similar shops (economically, constituents, mission) rather than one supporting the other. I like this idea in that it can lead to new attendees breaking out of the comfort zone of their team and interacting more with the broader community.
From the perspective of my shop (Broke Spoke, Lex KY), we'd probably find plenty of support in either of those scenarios. We'd be more than happy to pay a fee that went to creating a more geographically diverse conference. If we had a partner shop, our community would get behind bringing us together for a conference as well.
-Andy
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 11:33 AM, erk magosh <emailmyremail@gmail.commailto:emailmyremail@gmail.com> wrote: Angel,
" I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference."
One thing I think we want to avoid is setting up a caste system of people who pay and people who volunteer (indentured servants). At BikeBike everyone should be volunteers, it's a conference of problem solvers, and we can all come together to make it happen. No one is making money, so it should be on the conference as a whole to take on the work. One of the main goals should be to help build something and leave the city and the collective in better shape than we found it.
"Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment"
I don't disagree with anything you said, and we may want to think about the environmental impact of people traveling from all over the country (BTW driving alone in a car <9 hours has less impact than flying on a full plane the same distance). I however have gone to a few B!B!SEs (South East) and it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models. Especially in a region that is still heavily segregated(I did miss the B!B!SE in Atlanta, so I'm sure it was much different there). With this I think it would really benefit folx from the South East to be exposed to ideas of the larger group. Especially the collectivism of Latin America. I would say we could plan on only going to the annual international B!B! if it is in your region, and save money for it for the years it is not. However I think that would rely on the schedule being done a couple years a head. With the life expectancy of Bike Collectives I don't think that is realistic. (If you are from the SE and disagree with me, please let me know. I'm sure folx are working for social justice everywhere.)
My org really doesn't have money to spend on sending volunteers anywhere. We are focused on youth, so if we had money it would probably go towards sending youth to the Youth Bike Summit (YBS) or sending our youth mountain bike team to a meet.
thanks for adding to the conversation, -erk
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 5:48 PM, Angel York <aniola@gmail.commailto:aniola@gmail.com> wrote: I really like this idea! Here are a couple of thoughts:
I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference. Food was included. (I was really impressed by OSB conference; more details on the ways they focused on equity available if you're interested)
I was able to attend a Bici! Bici! in Southern California once because our bike collective paid the bus fare to travel for the only two people interested to travel all the way from Northern California. It was a great experience, and I still remember it years later.
I have never been to Bike! Bike!, but I've attended a couple regional Bici! Bici!s, because, in addition to the hardship of buying a ticket to a faraway place, I am a person who values being able to transport myself by bike, as I would expect some non-attendees are, and I have trouble getting past the environmental barrier of traveling such a long distance, even for what I know to be an amazing event with people I'd love to meet, see again, get to know, share with, learn from.
Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment. Angel York
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 2:42 PM, erk magosh <emailmyremail@gmail.commailto:emailmyremail@gmail.com> wrote: Hey y'all,
I have been throwing around ideas about travel equity after our trip to Mexico. For me a citizen of the US it was easy to get down there and was very affordable. I started thinking about why that was, and how it doesn't apply to everybody. Below is some suggestions that I have come up with. Most of these suggestions would really be up to the BikeBike hosts (Detroit in 2016), but the travel fund could be something we could start easily with donations. It is a rough draft and I'm looking for feedback (there has only been 5 minutes of feedback so far). Most of these ideas would take a bit of work, but I think it would be worth it to allow as many people to participate in BikeBike as possible.
let me/us know what you think, erk
BikeBike Travel Equity: Suggestions to Offset Inequitable Travel Cost and Barriers
Summary: In an aim to make BikeBike more inclusive we should help address travel inequities. Travel can be much harder/more expensive depending on what side of some imaginary lines a person was born on or what system they have to live in. We should encourage those with privilege to help those with less.
- Registration: registration fees should be very malleable. Folx that can pay more should be encouraged to support folx that cannot.
a. For some participants the registration fee is very cheap for all the services provided, others it may be a large expense.
- Travel funds should be created ahead of time to help folx with Visas/other travel expenses.
a. Donations or excess registration fees could create these funds.
b. Example of need: A Mexican Citizen needs to pay $300 USD just to apply for a visa to the USA. If they do not get approved they do not get the money back. For a US citizen with steady work this might not seem like a huge loss, but that works out to $5,100 MEX, which could be 3 or 4 times a person’s monthly housing cost.
- 3 meals (and snacks) a day at BikeBike.
a. Eatting out is by default expensive, but if you come from a country with an unfavorable currency exchange it is even more so. Even without that exchange, some people don’t have money to blow on a luxury like eating out.
b. This creates a bit more work, visiting BikeBikers should be encouraged to help cook and take any other loads off the hosts.
c. An alternative may be providing access to the kitchen when meals cannot be provided.
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also I forgot to mention Baltimore, Velocipede, and others, maybe hackerspaces/makerspaces would be interested, Philidelphia has something, don't think it was BikeBike, think it was an auction type eent, messenger race, alleycat, etc when I was starting out with Coops, now, 5-8+ years ago...
Will look into Rockville org mentioned in thread too.
Put up my drivel on MH blog like thingie http://novapeers.pbworks.com/w/page/101702614/BikeBikeHosting2015 re read and so many typos, but not done changes yet, mucked around on holiday with other stuff, trying to go to local food pantry by pedal cart/quad, etc many of which are described up there, met some bikers along the way, mostly racer types and local yuppie eating places, Shirlington, commentary by others, not very nice... Pantry closed, renovations/ gentrification of that area over 20-30+ years, was Best & Company, which was replaced by shops, small grocery, more boutique type places, part way down interstate 395, had a bike shop, but maybe Spokes, Etc up on Quander (Quaker?) and PhoenixBikes took over, too small footprint to compete? Best Buns bakery, gone? Honey Baked Ham? gone? smal ltheatre, car rental place, below airport, small basement library, moved, but if hotel chain,
and restaurant Carlyle Grand, still number one on travel rating site, might be good place to commute from for tourists, but rather expensive, not georgetown expensive, but upscale, lets say... Went to several of the shirlington places, usually with family, when I had more, was working, before disabled,for birthday, with crunchy granola (read roll your own religion, i.e. liberal) young adults church group, etc
and some other restaurants, bikers and others go, Patomic (sp?) Pedlars (sp?) did social D class eating rides from there, iirc, 20+ years ago.
Forgot to mention, BikeWashington.org, free (non membership based) group rides and C&O Canal Guide , plus more
On Mon, Oct 12, 2015 at 11:43 AM, Malagodi, Chuck H. CMalagodi@cabq.gov wrote:
Let me add my 2 cents for the first time on this forum . I work for the city of Albuquerque and am responsible for a bike safety education program that travel to many different school districts and a bike safety education center that has a community bike component. I have always wanted to go to Bike Bike for many years and am planning to go to Detroit as my vacation next year.
The City of Albuquerque does have funding and when Bike Bike came around to New Orleans I tried many times to get the organizers to charge me a conference fee and provide me with an itinerary so that I could attend. This was not something they could provide and hence I was unable to go. People who can pay to attend Bike Bike could offset the cost of people that cannot afford to go. I would also be happy to donate to a travel fund that the organizer would have to monitor and prioritize.
Chuck Malagodi
Outdoor Recreation Coordinator
1801 Fourth St. NW, Buliding A
Albuquerque, NM 87102
505-768-BIKE (2453)
Cmalagodi@cabq.gov
*From:* Thethinktank [mailto: thethinktank-bounces@lists.bikecollectives.org] *On Behalf Of *Andrew Shooner *Sent:* Sunday, October 11, 2015 5:57 PM *To:* The Think Tank *Subject:* Re: [TheThinkTank] Travel Equity for BikeBike
it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models.
Hey Erk. I don't think we've met, and I appreciate the discussion. In my experience, this is not accurate. I like the concept of addressing the inequitable access to the community. In terms of access to BikeBike, I think this has a lot of potential. Some brainstorming:
*Travel Grants (independent group)*
Very conventional. Probably would need some kind of fiduciary body to manage, then you get into taking and evaluating applications. bleh. One advantage I guess would be that it would probably be the most consistent model.
*Travel Grants (from BikeBike!)* If the grants were connected to the bikebike conference itself, and was either a mandatory or optional part of the registration fee, that could be an effective fundraising effort. This might require a bit more lead-time in the BikeBike conference organization, though. Also, I don't know who that would work financially.
*Partner Shops* Two or more shops/collectives distant from each other get paired up, and they pool their resources to send/bring one or more from each team to the national conference. This could be cool b/c it is way more interpersonal and organic. Would need to watch out for this becoming a paternal 'adopt-a-shop' scenario. It would be better for similar shops (economically, constituents, mission) rather than one supporting the other. I like this idea in that it can lead to new attendees breaking out of the comfort zone of their team and interacting more with the broader community.
From the perspective of my shop (Broke Spoke, Lex KY), we'd probably find plenty of support in either of those scenarios. We'd be more than happy to pay a fee that went to creating a more geographically diverse conference. If we had a partner shop, our community would get behind bringing us together for a conference as well.
-Andy
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 11:33 AM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Angel,
" I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference."
One thing I think we want to avoid is setting up a caste system of people who pay and people who volunteer (indentured servants). At BikeBike everyone should be volunteers, it's a conference of problem solvers, and we can all come together to make it happen. No one is making money, so it should be on the conference as a whole to take on the work. One of the main goals should be to help build something and leave the city and the collective in better shape than we found it.
"Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment"
I don't disagree with anything you said, and we may want to think about the environmental impact of people traveling from all over the country (BTW driving alone in a car <9 hours has less impact than flying on a full plane the same distance). I however have gone to a few B!B!SEs (South East) and it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models. Especially in a region that is still heavily segregated(I did miss the B!B!SE in Atlanta, so I'm sure it was much different there). With this I think it would really benefit folx from the South East to be exposed to ideas of the larger group. Especially the collectivism of Latin America. I would say we could plan on only going to the annual international B!B! if it is in your region, and save money for it for the years it is not. However I think that would rely on the schedule being done a couple years a head. With the life expectancy of Bike Collectives I don't think that is realistic. (If you are from the SE and disagree with me, please let me know. I'm sure folx are working for social justice everywhere.)
My org really doesn't have money to spend on sending volunteers anywhere. We are focused on youth, so if we had money it would probably go towards sending youth to the Youth Bike Summit (YBS) or sending our youth mountain bike team to a meet.
thanks for adding to the conversation, -erk
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 5:48 PM, Angel York aniola@gmail.com wrote:
I really like this idea! Here are a couple of thoughts:
- I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have
been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference. Food was included. (I was really impressed by OSB conference; more details on the ways they focused on equity available if you're interested)
- I was able to attend a Bici! Bici! in Southern California once because
our bike collective paid the bus fare to travel for the only two people interested to travel all the way from Northern California. It was a great experience, and I still remember it years later.
- I have never been to Bike! Bike!, but I've attended a couple regional
Bici! Bici!s, because, in addition to the hardship of buying a ticket to a faraway place, I am a person who values being able to transport myself by bike, as I would expect some non-attendees are, and I have trouble getting past the environmental barrier of traveling such a long distance, even for what I know to be an amazing event with people I'd love to meet, see again, get to know, share with, learn from.
Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment.
Angel York
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 2:42 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey y'all,
I have been throwing around ideas about travel equity after our trip to Mexico. For me a citizen of the US it was easy to get down there and was very affordable. I started thinking about why that was, and how it doesn't apply to everybody. Below is some suggestions that I have come up with. Most of these suggestions would really be up to the BikeBike hosts (Detroit in 2016), but the travel fund could be something we could start easily with donations. It is a rough draft and I'm looking for feedback (there has only been 5 minutes of feedback so far). Most of these ideas would take a bit of work, but I think it would be worth it to allow as many people to participate in BikeBike as possible.
let me/us know what you think,
erk
BikeBike Travel Equity:
Suggestions to Offset Inequitable Travel Cost and Barriers
Summary: In an aim to make BikeBike more inclusive we should help address travel inequities. Travel can be much harder/more expensive depending on what side of some imaginary lines a person was born on or what system they have to live in. We should encourage those with privilege to help those with less.
- Registration: registration fees should be very malleable. Folx that
can pay more should be encouraged to support folx that cannot.
a. For some participants the registration fee is very cheap for all the services provided, others it may be a large expense.
- Travel funds should be created ahead of time to help folx with
Visas/other travel expenses.
a. Donations or excess registration fees could create these funds.
b. Example of need: A Mexican Citizen needs to pay $300 USD just to apply for a visa to the USA. If they do not get approved they do not get the money back. For a US citizen with steady work this might not seem like a huge loss, but that works out to $5,100 MEX, which could be 3 or 4 times a person’s monthly housing cost.
- 3 meals (and snacks) a day at BikeBike.
a. Eatting out is by default expensive, but if you come from a country with an unfavorable currency exchange it is even more so. Even without that exchange, some people don’t have money to blow on a luxury like eating out.
b. This creates a bit more work, visiting BikeBikers should be encouraged to help cook and take any other loads off the hosts.
c. An alternative may be providing access to the kitchen when meals cannot be provided.
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Hi all, Happy, Joyous and Freewheeling doesn't have a physical space yet, since we are a very small startup in DC focusing on educational programs, but I just want to voice support for the idea of doing BikeBike here. I've never been to one, but if there are sessions held that are like other types of conference sessions, in indoor meeting rooms, I'm sure we could get any number of organizations in the district who would be willing to donate space. My day-job employer being one of several possibilities.
Thanks for posting the great notes and doing all the research on DC as a possible venue. Randi
On Tue, Oct 13, 2015 at 2:43 AM, DancesWithCars danceswithcars@gmail.com wrote:
also I forgot to mention Baltimore, Velocipede, and others, maybe hackerspaces/makerspaces would be interested, Philidelphia has something, don't think it was BikeBike, think it was an auction type eent, messenger race, alleycat, etc when I was starting out with Coops, now, 5-8+ years ago...
Will look into Rockville org mentioned in thread too.
Put up my drivel on MH blog like thingie http://novapeers.pbworks.com/w/page/101702614/BikeBikeHosting2015 re read and so many typos, but not done changes yet, mucked around on holiday with other stuff, trying to go to local food pantry by pedal cart/quad, etc many of which are described up there, met some bikers along the way, mostly racer types and local yuppie eating places, Shirlington, commentary by others, not very nice... Pantry closed, renovations/ gentrification of that area over 20-30+ years, was Best & Company, which was replaced by shops, small grocery, more boutique type places, part way down interstate 395, had a bike shop, but maybe Spokes, Etc up on Quander (Quaker?) and PhoenixBikes took over, too small footprint to compete? Best Buns bakery, gone? Honey Baked Ham? gone? smal ltheatre, car rental place, below airport, small basement library, moved, but if hotel chain,
and restaurant Carlyle Grand, still number one on travel rating site, might be good place to commute from for tourists, but rather expensive, not georgetown expensive, but upscale, lets say... Went to several of the shirlington places, usually with family, when I had more, was working, before disabled,for birthday, with crunchy granola (read roll your own religion, i.e. liberal) young adults church group, etc
and some other restaurants, bikers and others go, Patomic (sp?) Pedlars (sp?) did social D class eating rides from there, iirc, 20+ years ago.
Forgot to mention, BikeWashington.org, free (non membership based) group rides and C&O Canal Guide , plus more
On Mon, Oct 12, 2015 at 11:43 AM, Malagodi, Chuck H. CMalagodi@cabq.gov wrote:
Let me add my 2 cents for the first time on this forum . I work for the city of Albuquerque and am responsible for a bike safety education program that travel to many different school districts and a bike safety education center that has a community bike component. I have always wanted to go to Bike Bike for many years and am planning to go to Detroit as my vacation next year.
The City of Albuquerque does have funding and when Bike Bike came around to New Orleans I tried many times to get the organizers to charge me a conference fee and provide me with an itinerary so that I could attend. This was not something they could provide and hence I was unable to go. People who can pay to attend Bike Bike could offset the cost of people that cannot afford to go. I would also be happy to donate to a travel fund that the organizer would have to monitor and prioritize.
Chuck Malagodi
Outdoor Recreation Coordinator
1801 Fourth St. NW, Buliding A
Albuquerque, NM 87102
505-768-BIKE (2453)
Cmalagodi@cabq.gov
*From:* Thethinktank [mailto: thethinktank-bounces@lists.bikecollectives.org] *On Behalf Of *Andrew Shooner *Sent:* Sunday, October 11, 2015 5:57 PM *To:* The Think Tank *Subject:* Re: [TheThinkTank] Travel Equity for BikeBike
it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models.
Hey Erk. I don't think we've met, and I appreciate the discussion. In my experience, this is not accurate. I like the concept of addressing the inequitable access to the community. In terms of access to BikeBike, I think this has a lot of potential. Some brainstorming:
*Travel Grants (independent group)*
Very conventional. Probably would need some kind of fiduciary body to manage, then you get into taking and evaluating applications. bleh. One advantage I guess would be that it would probably be the most consistent model.
*Travel Grants (from BikeBike!)* If the grants were connected to the bikebike conference itself, and was either a mandatory or optional part of the registration fee, that could be an effective fundraising effort. This might require a bit more lead-time in the BikeBike conference organization, though. Also, I don't know who that would work financially.
*Partner Shops* Two or more shops/collectives distant from each other get paired up, and they pool their resources to send/bring one or more from each team to the national conference. This could be cool b/c it is way more interpersonal and organic. Would need to watch out for this becoming a paternal 'adopt-a-shop' scenario. It would be better for similar shops (economically, constituents, mission) rather than one supporting the other. I like this idea in that it can lead to new attendees breaking out of the comfort zone of their team and interacting more with the broader community.
From the perspective of my shop (Broke Spoke, Lex KY), we'd probably find plenty of support in either of those scenarios. We'd be more than happy to pay a fee that went to creating a more geographically diverse conference. If we had a partner shop, our community would get behind bringing us together for a conference as well.
-Andy
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 11:33 AM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Angel,
" I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference."
One thing I think we want to avoid is setting up a caste system of people who pay and people who volunteer (indentured servants). At BikeBike everyone should be volunteers, it's a conference of problem solvers, and we can all come together to make it happen. No one is making money, so it should be on the conference as a whole to take on the work. One of the main goals should be to help build something and leave the city and the collective in better shape than we found it.
"Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment"
I don't disagree with anything you said, and we may want to think about the environmental impact of people traveling from all over the country (BTW driving alone in a car <9 hours has less impact than flying on a full plane the same distance). I however have gone to a few B!B!SEs (South East) and it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models. Especially in a region that is still heavily segregated(I did miss the B!B!SE in Atlanta, so I'm sure it was much different there). With this I think it would really benefit folx from the South East to be exposed to ideas of the larger group. Especially the collectivism of Latin America. I would say we could plan on only going to the annual international B!B! if it is in your region, and save money for it for the years it is not. However I think that would rely on the schedule being done a couple years a head. With the life expectancy of Bike Collectives I don't think that is realistic. (If you are from the SE and disagree with me, please let me know. I'm sure folx are working for social justice everywhere.)
My org really doesn't have money to spend on sending volunteers anywhere. We are focused on youth, so if we had money it would probably go towards sending youth to the Youth Bike Summit (YBS) or sending our youth mountain bike team to a meet.
thanks for adding to the conversation, -erk
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 5:48 PM, Angel York aniola@gmail.com wrote:
I really like this idea! Here are a couple of thoughts:
- I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have
been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference. Food was included. (I was really impressed by OSB conference; more details on the ways they focused on equity available if you're interested)
- I was able to attend a Bici! Bici! in Southern California once because
our bike collective paid the bus fare to travel for the only two people interested to travel all the way from Northern California. It was a great experience, and I still remember it years later.
- I have never been to Bike! Bike!, but I've attended a couple regional
Bici! Bici!s, because, in addition to the hardship of buying a ticket to a faraway place, I am a person who values being able to transport myself by bike, as I would expect some non-attendees are, and I have trouble getting past the environmental barrier of traveling such a long distance, even for what I know to be an amazing event with people I'd love to meet, see again, get to know, share with, learn from.
Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment.
Angel York
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 2:42 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey y'all,
I have been throwing around ideas about travel equity after our trip to Mexico. For me a citizen of the US it was easy to get down there and was very affordable. I started thinking about why that was, and how it doesn't apply to everybody. Below is some suggestions that I have come up with. Most of these suggestions would really be up to the BikeBike hosts (Detroit in 2016), but the travel fund could be something we could start easily with donations. It is a rough draft and I'm looking for feedback (there has only been 5 minutes of feedback so far). Most of these ideas would take a bit of work, but I think it would be worth it to allow as many people to participate in BikeBike as possible.
let me/us know what you think,
erk
BikeBike Travel Equity:
Suggestions to Offset Inequitable Travel Cost and Barriers
Summary: In an aim to make BikeBike more inclusive we should help address travel inequities. Travel can be much harder/more expensive depending on what side of some imaginary lines a person was born on or what system they have to live in. We should encourage those with privilege to help those with less.
- Registration: registration fees should be very malleable. Folx
that can pay more should be encouraged to support folx that cannot.
a. For some participants the registration fee is very cheap for all the services provided, others it may be a large expense.
- Travel funds should be created ahead of time to help folx with
Visas/other travel expenses.
a. Donations or excess registration fees could create these funds.
b. Example of need: A Mexican Citizen needs to pay $300 USD just to apply for a visa to the USA. If they do not get approved they do not get the money back. For a US citizen with steady work this might not seem like a huge loss, but that works out to $5,100 MEX, which could be 3 or 4 times a person’s monthly housing cost.
- 3 meals (and snacks) a day at BikeBike.
a. Eatting out is by default expensive, but if you come from a country with an unfavorable currency exchange it is even more so. Even without that exchange, some people don’t have money to blow on a luxury like eating out.
b. This creates a bit more work, visiting BikeBikers should be encouraged to help cook and take any other loads off the hosts.
c. An alternative may be providing access to the kitchen when meals cannot be provided.
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-- DancesWithCars leave the wolves behind ;-)
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Hey all you DC area peeps that want BikeBike to come to DC: BikeBike SE will be in Richmond VA in March. That's a 2.5 hour bus ride or a 2 day (12 hour) bike ride. Please go and experience the conference.
-erk
On Fri, Oct 16, 2015 at 3:25 PM, Randi Park rsolomonpark@gmail.com wrote:
Hi all, Happy, Joyous and Freewheeling doesn't have a physical space yet, since we are a very small startup in DC focusing on educational programs, but I just want to voice support for the idea of doing BikeBike here. I've never been to one, but if there are sessions held that are like other types of conference sessions, in indoor meeting rooms, I'm sure we could get any number of organizations in the district who would be willing to donate space. My day-job employer being one of several possibilities.
Thanks for posting the great notes and doing all the research on DC as a possible venue. Randi
On Tue, Oct 13, 2015 at 2:43 AM, DancesWithCars danceswithcars@gmail.com wrote:
also I forgot to mention Baltimore, Velocipede, and others, maybe hackerspaces/makerspaces would be interested, Philidelphia has something, don't think it was BikeBike, think it was an auction type eent, messenger race, alleycat, etc when I was starting out with Coops, now, 5-8+ years ago...
Will look into Rockville org mentioned in thread too.
Put up my drivel on MH blog like thingie http://novapeers.pbworks.com/w/page/101702614/BikeBikeHosting2015 re read and so many typos, but not done changes yet, mucked around on holiday with other stuff, trying to go to local food pantry by pedal cart/quad, etc many of which are described up there, met some bikers along the way, mostly racer types and local yuppie eating places, Shirlington, commentary by others, not very nice... Pantry closed, renovations/ gentrification of that area over 20-30+ years, was Best & Company, which was replaced by shops, small grocery, more boutique type places, part way down interstate 395, had a bike shop, but maybe Spokes, Etc up on Quander (Quaker?) and PhoenixBikes took over, too small footprint to compete? Best Buns bakery, gone? Honey Baked Ham? gone? smal ltheatre, car rental place, below airport, small basement library, moved, but if hotel chain,
and restaurant Carlyle Grand, still number one on travel rating site, might be good place to commute from for tourists, but rather expensive, not georgetown expensive, but upscale, lets say... Went to several of the shirlington places, usually with family, when I had more, was working, before disabled,for birthday, with crunchy granola (read roll your own religion, i.e. liberal) young adults church group, etc
and some other restaurants, bikers and others go, Patomic (sp?) Pedlars (sp?) did social D class eating rides from there, iirc, 20+ years ago.
Forgot to mention, BikeWashington.org, free (non membership based) group rides and C&O Canal Guide , plus more
On Mon, Oct 12, 2015 at 11:43 AM, Malagodi, Chuck H. CMalagodi@cabq.gov wrote:
Let me add my 2 cents for the first time on this forum . I work for the city of Albuquerque and am responsible for a bike safety education program that travel to many different school districts and a bike safety education center that has a community bike component. I have always wanted to go to Bike Bike for many years and am planning to go to Detroit as my vacation next year.
The City of Albuquerque does have funding and when Bike Bike came around to New Orleans I tried many times to get the organizers to charge me a conference fee and provide me with an itinerary so that I could attend. This was not something they could provide and hence I was unable to go. People who can pay to attend Bike Bike could offset the cost of people that cannot afford to go. I would also be happy to donate to a travel fund that the organizer would have to monitor and prioritize.
Chuck Malagodi
Outdoor Recreation Coordinator
1801 Fourth St. NW, Buliding A
Albuquerque, NM 87102
505-768-BIKE (2453)
Cmalagodi@cabq.gov
*From:* Thethinktank [mailto: thethinktank-bounces@lists.bikecollectives.org] *On Behalf Of *Andrew Shooner *Sent:* Sunday, October 11, 2015 5:57 PM *To:* The Think Tank *Subject:* Re: [TheThinkTank] Travel Equity for BikeBike
it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models.
Hey Erk. I don't think we've met, and I appreciate the discussion. In my experience, this is not accurate. I like the concept of addressing the inequitable access to the community. In terms of access to BikeBike, I think this has a lot of potential. Some brainstorming:
*Travel Grants (independent group)*
Very conventional. Probably would need some kind of fiduciary body to manage, then you get into taking and evaluating applications. bleh. One advantage I guess would be that it would probably be the most consistent model.
*Travel Grants (from BikeBike!)* If the grants were connected to the bikebike conference itself, and was either a mandatory or optional part of the registration fee, that could be an effective fundraising effort. This might require a bit more lead-time in the BikeBike conference organization, though. Also, I don't know who that would work financially.
*Partner Shops* Two or more shops/collectives distant from each other get paired up, and they pool their resources to send/bring one or more from each team to the national conference. This could be cool b/c it is way more interpersonal and organic. Would need to watch out for this becoming a paternal 'adopt-a-shop' scenario. It would be better for similar shops (economically, constituents, mission) rather than one supporting the other. I like this idea in that it can lead to new attendees breaking out of the comfort zone of their team and interacting more with the broader community.
From the perspective of my shop (Broke Spoke, Lex KY), we'd probably find plenty of support in either of those scenarios. We'd be more than happy to pay a fee that went to creating a more geographically diverse conference. If we had a partner shop, our community would get behind bringing us together for a conference as well.
-Andy
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 11:33 AM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Angel,
" I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference."
One thing I think we want to avoid is setting up a caste system of people who pay and people who volunteer (indentured servants). At BikeBike everyone should be volunteers, it's a conference of problem solvers, and we can all come together to make it happen. No one is making money, so it should be on the conference as a whole to take on the work. One of the main goals should be to help build something and leave the city and the collective in better shape than we found it.
"Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment"
I don't disagree with anything you said, and we may want to think about the environmental impact of people traveling from all over the country (BTW driving alone in a car <9 hours has less impact than flying on a full plane the same distance). I however have gone to a few B!B!SEs (South East) and it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models. Especially in a region that is still heavily segregated(I did miss the B!B!SE in Atlanta, so I'm sure it was much different there). With this I think it would really benefit folx from the South East to be exposed to ideas of the larger group. Especially the collectivism of Latin America. I would say we could plan on only going to the annual international B!B! if it is in your region, and save money for it for the years it is not. However I think that would rely on the schedule being done a couple years a head. With the life expectancy of Bike Collectives I don't think that is realistic. (If you are from the SE and disagree with me, please let me know. I'm sure folx are working for social justice everywhere.)
My org really doesn't have money to spend on sending volunteers anywhere. We are focused on youth, so if we had money it would probably go towards sending youth to the Youth Bike Summit (YBS) or sending our youth mountain bike team to a meet.
thanks for adding to the conversation, -erk
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 5:48 PM, Angel York aniola@gmail.com wrote:
I really like this idea! Here are a couple of thoughts:
- I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise
have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference. Food was included. (I was really impressed by OSB conference; more details on the ways they focused on equity available if you're interested)
- I was able to attend a Bici! Bici! in Southern California once because
our bike collective paid the bus fare to travel for the only two people interested to travel all the way from Northern California. It was a great experience, and I still remember it years later.
- I have never been to Bike! Bike!, but I've attended a couple regional
Bici! Bici!s, because, in addition to the hardship of buying a ticket to a faraway place, I am a person who values being able to transport myself by bike, as I would expect some non-attendees are, and I have trouble getting past the environmental barrier of traveling such a long distance, even for what I know to be an amazing event with people I'd love to meet, see again, get to know, share with, learn from.
Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment.
Angel York
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 2:42 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey y'all,
I have been throwing around ideas about travel equity after our trip to Mexico. For me a citizen of the US it was easy to get down there and was very affordable. I started thinking about why that was, and how it doesn't apply to everybody. Below is some suggestions that I have come up with. Most of these suggestions would really be up to the BikeBike hosts (Detroit in 2016), but the travel fund could be something we could start easily with donations. It is a rough draft and I'm looking for feedback (there has only been 5 minutes of feedback so far). Most of these ideas would take a bit of work, but I think it would be worth it to allow as many people to participate in BikeBike as possible.
let me/us know what you think,
erk
BikeBike Travel Equity:
Suggestions to Offset Inequitable Travel Cost and Barriers
Summary: In an aim to make BikeBike more inclusive we should help address travel inequities. Travel can be much harder/more expensive depending on what side of some imaginary lines a person was born on or what system they have to live in. We should encourage those with privilege to help those with less.
- Registration: registration fees should be very malleable. Folx
that can pay more should be encouraged to support folx that cannot.
a. For some participants the registration fee is very cheap for all the services provided, others it may be a large expense.
- Travel funds should be created ahead of time to help folx with
Visas/other travel expenses.
a. Donations or excess registration fees could create these funds.
b. Example of need: A Mexican Citizen needs to pay $300 USD just to apply for a visa to the USA. If they do not get approved they do not get the money back. For a US citizen with steady work this might not seem like a huge loss, but that works out to $5,100 MEX, which could be 3 or 4 times a person’s monthly housing cost.
- 3 meals (and snacks) a day at BikeBike.
a. Eatting out is by default expensive, but if you come from a country with an unfavorable currency exchange it is even more so. Even without that exchange, some people don’t have money to blow on a luxury like eating out.
b. This creates a bit more work, visiting BikeBikers should be encouraged to help cook and take any other loads off the hosts.
c. An alternative may be providing access to the kitchen when meals cannot be provided.
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-- DancesWithCars leave the wolves behind ;-)
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Chuck,
Just to clarify what you said: You could of had the City of Albuquerque pay your way to B!B! New Orleans, but the Nola organizers couldn't provide you with official enough documentation/bill you?
On Mon, Oct 12, 2015 at 10:43 AM, Malagodi, Chuck H. CMalagodi@cabq.gov wrote:
Let me add my 2 cents for the first time on this forum . I work for the city of Albuquerque and am responsible for a bike safety education program that travel to many different school districts and a bike safety education center that has a community bike component. I have always wanted to go to Bike Bike for many years and am planning to go to Detroit as my vacation next year.
The City of Albuquerque does have funding and when Bike Bike came around to New Orleans I tried many times to get the organizers to charge me a conference fee and provide me with an itinerary so that I could attend. This was not something they could provide and hence I was unable to go. People who can pay to attend Bike Bike could offset the cost of people that cannot afford to go. I would also be happy to donate to a travel fund that the organizer would have to monitor and prioritize.
Chuck Malagodi
Outdoor Recreation Coordinator
1801 Fourth St. NW, Buliding A
Albuquerque, NM 87102
505-768-BIKE (2453)
Cmalagodi@cabq.gov
*From:* Thethinktank [mailto: thethinktank-bounces@lists.bikecollectives.org] *On Behalf Of *Andrew Shooner *Sent:* Sunday, October 11, 2015 5:57 PM *To:* The Think Tank *Subject:* Re: [TheThinkTank] Travel Equity for BikeBike
it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models.
Hey Erk. I don't think we've met, and I appreciate the discussion. In my experience, this is not accurate. I like the concept of addressing the inequitable access to the community. In terms of access to BikeBike, I think this has a lot of potential. Some brainstorming:
*Travel Grants (independent group)*
Very conventional. Probably would need some kind of fiduciary body to manage, then you get into taking and evaluating applications. bleh. One advantage I guess would be that it would probably be the most consistent model.
*Travel Grants (from BikeBike!)* If the grants were connected to the bikebike conference itself, and was either a mandatory or optional part of the registration fee, that could be an effective fundraising effort. This might require a bit more lead-time in the BikeBike conference organization, though. Also, I don't know who that would work financially.
*Partner Shops* Two or more shops/collectives distant from each other get paired up, and they pool their resources to send/bring one or more from each team to the national conference. This could be cool b/c it is way more interpersonal and organic. Would need to watch out for this becoming a paternal 'adopt-a-shop' scenario. It would be better for similar shops (economically, constituents, mission) rather than one supporting the other. I like this idea in that it can lead to new attendees breaking out of the comfort zone of their team and interacting more with the broader community.
From the perspective of my shop (Broke Spoke, Lex KY), we'd probably find plenty of support in either of those scenarios. We'd be more than happy to pay a fee that went to creating a more geographically diverse conference. If we had a partner shop, our community would get behind bringing us together for a conference as well.
-Andy
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 11:33 AM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Angel,
" I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference."
One thing I think we want to avoid is setting up a caste system of people who pay and people who volunteer (indentured servants). At BikeBike everyone should be volunteers, it's a conference of problem solvers, and we can all come together to make it happen. No one is making money, so it should be on the conference as a whole to take on the work. One of the main goals should be to help build something and leave the city and the collective in better shape than we found it.
"Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment"
I don't disagree with anything you said, and we may want to think about the environmental impact of people traveling from all over the country (BTW driving alone in a car <9 hours has less impact than flying on a full plane the same distance). I however have gone to a few B!B!SEs (South East) and it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models. Especially in a region that is still heavily segregated(I did miss the B!B!SE in Atlanta, so I'm sure it was much different there). With this I think it would really benefit folx from the South East to be exposed to ideas of the larger group. Especially the collectivism of Latin America. I would say we could plan on only going to the annual international B!B! if it is in your region, and save money for it for the years it is not. However I think that would rely on the schedule being done a couple years a head. With the life expectancy of Bike Collectives I don't think that is realistic. (If you are from the SE and disagree with me, please let me know. I'm sure folx are working for social justice everywhere.)
My org really doesn't have money to spend on sending volunteers anywhere. We are focused on youth, so if we had money it would probably go towards sending youth to the Youth Bike Summit (YBS) or sending our youth mountain bike team to a meet.
thanks for adding to the conversation, -erk
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 5:48 PM, Angel York aniola@gmail.com wrote:
I really like this idea! Here are a couple of thoughts:
- I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have
been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference. Food was included. (I was really impressed by OSB conference; more details on the ways they focused on equity available if you're interested)
- I was able to attend a Bici! Bici! in Southern California once because
our bike collective paid the bus fare to travel for the only two people interested to travel all the way from Northern California. It was a great experience, and I still remember it years later.
- I have never been to Bike! Bike!, but I've attended a couple regional
Bici! Bici!s, because, in addition to the hardship of buying a ticket to a faraway place, I am a person who values being able to transport myself by bike, as I would expect some non-attendees are, and I have trouble getting past the environmental barrier of traveling such a long distance, even for what I know to be an amazing event with people I'd love to meet, see again, get to know, share with, learn from.
Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment.
Angel York
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 2:42 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey y'all,
I have been throwing around ideas about travel equity after our trip to Mexico. For me a citizen of the US it was easy to get down there and was very affordable. I started thinking about why that was, and how it doesn't apply to everybody. Below is some suggestions that I have come up with. Most of these suggestions would really be up to the BikeBike hosts (Detroit in 2016), but the travel fund could be something we could start easily with donations. It is a rough draft and I'm looking for feedback (there has only been 5 minutes of feedback so far). Most of these ideas would take a bit of work, but I think it would be worth it to allow as many people to participate in BikeBike as possible.
let me/us know what you think,
erk
BikeBike Travel Equity:
Suggestions to Offset Inequitable Travel Cost and Barriers
Summary: In an aim to make BikeBike more inclusive we should help address travel inequities. Travel can be much harder/more expensive depending on what side of some imaginary lines a person was born on or what system they have to live in. We should encourage those with privilege to help those with less.
- Registration: registration fees should be very malleable. Folx that
can pay more should be encouraged to support folx that cannot.
a. For some participants the registration fee is very cheap for all the services provided, others it may be a large expense.
- Travel funds should be created ahead of time to help folx with
Visas/other travel expenses.
a. Donations or excess registration fees could create these funds.
b. Example of need: A Mexican Citizen needs to pay $300 USD just to apply for a visa to the USA. If they do not get approved they do not get the money back. For a US citizen with steady work this might not seem like a huge loss, but that works out to $5,100 MEX, which could be 3 or 4 times a person’s monthly housing cost.
- 3 meals (and snacks) a day at BikeBike.
a. Eatting out is by default expensive, but if you come from a country with an unfavorable currency exchange it is even more so. Even without that exchange, some people don’t have money to blow on a luxury like eating out.
b. This creates a bit more work, visiting BikeBikers should be encouraged to help cook and take any other loads off the hosts.
c. An alternative may be providing access to the kitchen when meals cannot be provided.
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Hey andy I was hesitant to say that cause I knew that I was probably wrong, it was just a feeling I had with little evidence to back it up. If I could take it back I would. Anyways a more general "people can benefit from ideas from out side their region" would of worked much better. Sorry for the judgmental statement that did little to add to the conversation and could of turned potential collaborators off. Thanks for not taking offense and actually adding to the conversation.
As for the ideas you mentioned they are great. Right now I feel like all I can do with them is (along with the other great suggestions from the TT and FB) is copy them down and try to organize them in one place until we can get a group of people working on them. Thanks so much.
-erk
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 6:56 PM, Andrew Shooner ashooner@gmail.com wrote:
it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that
are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models.
Hey Erk. I don't think we've met, and I appreciate the discussion. In my experience, this is not accurate. I like the concept of addressing the inequitable access to the community. In terms of access to BikeBike, I think this has a lot of potential. Some brainstorming:
*Travel Grants (independent group)* Very conventional. Probably would need some kind of fiduciary body to manage, then you get into taking and evaluating applications. bleh. One advantage I guess would be that it would probably be the most consistent model.
*Travel Grants (from BikeBike!)* If the grants were connected to the bikebike conference itself, and was either a mandatory or optional part of the registration fee, that could be an effective fundraising effort. This might require a bit more lead-time in the BikeBike conference organization, though. Also, I don't know who that would work financially.
*Partner Shops* Two or more shops/collectives distant from each other get paired up, and they pool their resources to send/bring one or more from each team to the national conference. This could be cool b/c it is way more interpersonal and organic. Would need to watch out for this becoming a paternal 'adopt-a-shop' scenario. It would be better for similar shops (economically, constituents, mission) rather than one supporting the other. I like this idea in that it can lead to new attendees breaking out of the comfort zone of their team and interacting more with the broader community.
From the perspective of my shop (Broke Spoke, Lex KY), we'd probably find plenty of support in either of those scenarios. We'd be more than happy to pay a fee that went to creating a more geographically diverse conference. If we had a partner shop, our community would get behind bringing us together for a conference as well.
-Andy
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 11:33 AM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Angel,
" I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference."
One thing I think we want to avoid is setting up a caste system of people who pay and people who volunteer (indentured servants). At BikeBike everyone should be volunteers, it's a conference of problem solvers, and we can all come together to make it happen. No one is making money, so it should be on the conference as a whole to take on the work. One of the main goals should be to help build something and leave the city and the collective in better shape than we found it.
"Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment"
I don't disagree with anything you said, and we may want to think about the environmental impact of people traveling from all over the country (BTW driving alone in a car <9 hours has less impact than flying on a full plane the same distance). I however have gone to a few B!B!SEs (South East) and it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models. Especially in a region that is still heavily segregated(I did miss the B!B!SE in Atlanta, so I'm sure it was much different there). With this I think it would really benefit folx from the South East to be exposed to ideas of the larger group. Especially the collectivism of Latin America. I would say we could plan on only going to the annual international B!B! if it is in your region, and save money for it for the years it is not. However I think that would rely on the schedule being done a couple years a head. With the life expectancy of Bike Collectives I don't think that is realistic. (If you are from the SE and disagree with me, please let me know. I'm sure folx are working for social justice everywhere.)
My org really doesn't have money to spend on sending volunteers anywhere. We are focused on youth, so if we had money it would probably go towards sending youth to the Youth Bike Summit (YBS) or sending our youth mountain bike team to a meet.
thanks for adding to the conversation, -erk
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 5:48 PM, Angel York aniola@gmail.com wrote:
I really like this idea! Here are a couple of thoughts:
- I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise
have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference. Food was included. (I was really impressed by OSB conference; more details on the ways they focused on equity available if you're interested)
- I was able to attend a Bici! Bici! in Southern California once because
our bike collective paid the bus fare to travel for the only two people interested to travel all the way from Northern California. It was a great experience, and I still remember it years later.
- I have never been to Bike! Bike!, but I've attended a couple regional
Bici! Bici!s, because, in addition to the hardship of buying a ticket to a faraway place, I am a person who values being able to transport myself by bike, as I would expect some non-attendees are, and I have trouble getting past the environmental barrier of traveling such a long distance, even for what I know to be an amazing event with people I'd love to meet, see again, get to know, share with, learn from.
Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment.
Angel York
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 2:42 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey y'all,
I have been throwing around ideas about travel equity after our trip to Mexico. For me a citizen of the US it was easy to get down there and was very affordable. I started thinking about why that was, and how it doesn't apply to everybody. Below is some suggestions that I have come up with. Most of these suggestions would really be up to the BikeBike hosts (Detroit in 2016), but the travel fund could be something we could start easily with donations. It is a rough draft and I'm looking for feedback (there has only been 5 minutes of feedback so far). Most of these ideas would take a bit of work, but I think it would be worth it to allow as many people to participate in BikeBike as possible.
let me/us know what you think, erk
BikeBike Travel Equity:
Suggestions to Offset Inequitable Travel Cost and Barriers
Summary: In an aim to make BikeBike more inclusive we should help address travel inequities. Travel can be much harder/more expensive depending on what side of some imaginary lines a person was born on or what system they have to live in. We should encourage those with privilege to help those with less.
- Registration: registration fees should be very malleable. Folx
that can pay more should be encouraged to support folx that cannot.
a. For some participants the registration fee is very cheap for all the services provided, others it may be a large expense.
- Travel funds should be created ahead of time to help folx with
Visas/other travel expenses.
a. Donations or excess registration fees could create these funds.
b. Example of need: A Mexican Citizen needs to pay $300 USD just to apply for a visa to the USA. If they do not get approved they do not get the money back. For a US citizen with steady work this might not seem like a huge loss, but that works out to $5,100 MEX, which could be 3 or 4 times a person’s monthly housing cost.
- 3 meals (and snacks) a day at BikeBike.
a. Eatting out is by default expensive, but if you come from a country with an unfavorable currency exchange it is even more so. Even without that exchange, some people don’t have money to blow on a luxury like eating out.
b. This creates a bit more work, visiting BikeBikers should be encouraged to help cook and take any other loads off the hosts.
c. An alternative may be providing access to the kitchen when meals cannot be provided.
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Hey andy I was hesitant to say that cause I knew that I was probably wrong, it was just a feeling I had with little evidence to back it up. If I could take it back I would.
No worries! As much as I use it every day, I still think email is a tough medium to communicate real ideas through; it takes the humanity out of those you're trying to connect with. Self-censoring your thoughts is just as bad as stepping on someone's feelings, IMHO.
Regardless of specifics, I think you got to a fundamental question: How do we connect shops that have limited resources, but have diverse solutions to working with those resources.
On Tue, Oct 13, 2015 at 7:10 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey andy I was hesitant to say that cause I knew that I was probably wrong, it was just a feeling I had with little evidence to back it up. If I could take it back I would. Anyways a more general "people can benefit from ideas from out side their region" would of worked much better. Sorry for the judgmental statement that did little to add to the conversation and could of turned potential collaborators off. Thanks for not taking offense and actually adding to the conversation.
As for the ideas you mentioned they are great. Right now I feel like all I can do with them is (along with the other great suggestions from the TT and FB) is copy them down and try to organize them in one place until we can get a group of people working on them. Thanks so much.
-erk
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 6:56 PM, Andrew Shooner ashooner@gmail.com wrote:
it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops
that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models.
Hey Erk. I don't think we've met, and I appreciate the discussion. In my experience, this is not accurate. I like the concept of addressing the inequitable access to the community. In terms of access to BikeBike, I think this has a lot of potential. Some brainstorming:
*Travel Grants (independent group)* Very conventional. Probably would need some kind of fiduciary body to manage, then you get into taking and evaluating applications. bleh. One advantage I guess would be that it would probably be the most consistent model.
*Travel Grants (from BikeBike!)* If the grants were connected to the bikebike conference itself, and was either a mandatory or optional part of the registration fee, that could be an effective fundraising effort. This might require a bit more lead-time in the BikeBike conference organization, though. Also, I don't know who that would work financially.
*Partner Shops* Two or more shops/collectives distant from each other get paired up, and they pool their resources to send/bring one or more from each team to the national conference. This could be cool b/c it is way more interpersonal and organic. Would need to watch out for this becoming a paternal 'adopt-a-shop' scenario. It would be better for similar shops (economically, constituents, mission) rather than one supporting the other. I like this idea in that it can lead to new attendees breaking out of the comfort zone of their team and interacting more with the broader community.
From the perspective of my shop (Broke Spoke, Lex KY), we'd probably find plenty of support in either of those scenarios. We'd be more than happy to pay a fee that went to creating a more geographically diverse conference. If we had a partner shop, our community would get behind bringing us together for a conference as well.
-Andy
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 11:33 AM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Angel,
" I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference."
One thing I think we want to avoid is setting up a caste system of people who pay and people who volunteer (indentured servants). At BikeBike everyone should be volunteers, it's a conference of problem solvers, and we can all come together to make it happen. No one is making money, so it should be on the conference as a whole to take on the work. One of the main goals should be to help build something and leave the city and the collective in better shape than we found it.
"Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment"
I don't disagree with anything you said, and we may want to think about the environmental impact of people traveling from all over the country (BTW driving alone in a car <9 hours has less impact than flying on a full plane the same distance). I however have gone to a few B!B!SEs (South East) and it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models. Especially in a region that is still heavily segregated(I did miss the B!B!SE in Atlanta, so I'm sure it was much different there). With this I think it would really benefit folx from the South East to be exposed to ideas of the larger group. Especially the collectivism of Latin America. I would say we could plan on only going to the annual international B!B! if it is in your region, and save money for it for the years it is not. However I think that would rely on the schedule being done a couple years a head. With the life expectancy of Bike Collectives I don't think that is realistic. (If you are from the SE and disagree with me, please let me know. I'm sure folx are working for social justice everywhere.)
My org really doesn't have money to spend on sending volunteers anywhere. We are focused on youth, so if we had money it would probably go towards sending youth to the Youth Bike Summit (YBS) or sending our youth mountain bike team to a meet.
thanks for adding to the conversation, -erk
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 5:48 PM, Angel York aniola@gmail.com wrote:
I really like this idea! Here are a couple of thoughts:
- I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise
have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference. Food was included. (I was really impressed by OSB conference; more details on the ways they focused on equity available if you're interested)
- I was able to attend a Bici! Bici! in Southern California once
because our bike collective paid the bus fare to travel for the only two people interested to travel all the way from Northern California. It was a great experience, and I still remember it years later.
- I have never been to Bike! Bike!, but I've attended a couple regional
Bici! Bici!s, because, in addition to the hardship of buying a ticket to a faraway place, I am a person who values being able to transport myself by bike, as I would expect some non-attendees are, and I have trouble getting past the environmental barrier of traveling such a long distance, even for what I know to be an amazing event with people I'd love to meet, see again, get to know, share with, learn from.
Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment.
Angel York
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 2:42 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey y'all,
I have been throwing around ideas about travel equity after our trip to Mexico. For me a citizen of the US it was easy to get down there and was very affordable. I started thinking about why that was, and how it doesn't apply to everybody. Below is some suggestions that I have come up with. Most of these suggestions would really be up to the BikeBike hosts (Detroit in 2016), but the travel fund could be something we could start easily with donations. It is a rough draft and I'm looking for feedback (there has only been 5 minutes of feedback so far). Most of these ideas would take a bit of work, but I think it would be worth it to allow as many people to participate in BikeBike as possible.
let me/us know what you think, erk
BikeBike Travel Equity:
Suggestions to Offset Inequitable Travel Cost and Barriers
Summary: In an aim to make BikeBike more inclusive we should help address travel inequities. Travel can be much harder/more expensive depending on what side of some imaginary lines a person was born on or what system they have to live in. We should encourage those with privilege to help those with less.
- Registration: registration fees should be very malleable. Folx
that can pay more should be encouraged to support folx that cannot.
a. For some participants the registration fee is very cheap for all the services provided, others it may be a large expense.
- Travel funds should be created ahead of time to help folx with
Visas/other travel expenses.
a. Donations or excess registration fees could create these funds.
b. Example of need: A Mexican Citizen needs to pay $300 USD just to apply for a visa to the USA. If they do not get approved they do not get the money back. For a US citizen with steady work this might not seem like a huge loss, but that works out to $5,100 MEX, which could be 3 or 4 times a person’s monthly housing cost.
- 3 meals (and snacks) a day at BikeBike.
a. Eatting out is by default expensive, but if you come from a country with an unfavorable currency exchange it is even more so. Even without that exchange, some people don’t have money to blow on a luxury like eating out.
b. This creates a bit more work, visiting BikeBikers should be encouraged to help cook and take any other loads off the hosts.
c. An alternative may be providing access to the kitchen when meals cannot be provided.
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Hey folks! In fact, work exchanges and travel equity have been discussed at a few Bike! Bike!s. We had a working group two years ago in advance of Columbus that we almost certainly still have some documents squirrelled away from, and at Bike! Bike! this year this issue came up again as one way in which our shops and orgs could learn from one another and do meaningful transnational organization. If you are interested in spending some time working on this with other folks, you might consider joining the working group we are forming.
An additional point to consider is that some shops and folks who are interested in exchanges are primarily Spanish speakers, so if you do decide to join us, keeping your contributions clear and concise so that they are easy to translate, or providing at least English and Spanish translation if you have that capacity would be a major step towards including important voices in these discussions.
Wanna work with us? Fire me an email and I'll add you to the working group! Thinktank updates coming soon.
:) Lauren
On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 11:42 AM, Andrew Shooner ashooner@gmail.com wrote:
Hey andy I was hesitant to say that cause I knew that I was probably
wrong, it was just a feeling I had with little evidence to back it up. If I could take it back I would.
No worries! As much as I use it every day, I still think email is a tough medium to communicate real ideas through; it takes the humanity out of those you're trying to connect with. Self-censoring your thoughts is just as bad as stepping on someone's feelings, IMHO.
Regardless of specifics, I think you got to a fundamental question: How do we connect shops that have limited resources, but have diverse solutions to working with those resources.
On Tue, Oct 13, 2015 at 7:10 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey andy I was hesitant to say that cause I knew that I was probably wrong, it was just a feeling I had with little evidence to back it up. If I could take it back I would. Anyways a more general "people can benefit from ideas from out side their region" would of worked much better. Sorry for the judgmental statement that did little to add to the conversation and could of turned potential collaborators off. Thanks for not taking offense and actually adding to the conversation.
As for the ideas you mentioned they are great. Right now I feel like all I can do with them is (along with the other great suggestions from the TT and FB) is copy them down and try to organize them in one place until we can get a group of people working on them. Thanks so much.
-erk
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 6:56 PM, Andrew Shooner ashooner@gmail.com wrote:
it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops
that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models.
Hey Erk. I don't think we've met, and I appreciate the discussion. In my experience, this is not accurate. I like the concept of addressing the inequitable access to the community. In terms of access to BikeBike, I think this has a lot of potential. Some brainstorming:
*Travel Grants (independent group)* Very conventional. Probably would need some kind of fiduciary body to manage, then you get into taking and evaluating applications. bleh. One advantage I guess would be that it would probably be the most consistent model.
*Travel Grants (from BikeBike!)* If the grants were connected to the bikebike conference itself, and was either a mandatory or optional part of the registration fee, that could be an effective fundraising effort. This might require a bit more lead-time in the BikeBike conference organization, though. Also, I don't know who that would work financially.
*Partner Shops* Two or more shops/collectives distant from each other get paired up, and they pool their resources to send/bring one or more from each team to the national conference. This could be cool b/c it is way more interpersonal and organic. Would need to watch out for this becoming a paternal 'adopt-a-shop' scenario. It would be better for similar shops (economically, constituents, mission) rather than one supporting the other. I like this idea in that it can lead to new attendees breaking out of the comfort zone of their team and interacting more with the broader community.
From the perspective of my shop (Broke Spoke, Lex KY), we'd probably find plenty of support in either of those scenarios. We'd be more than happy to pay a fee that went to creating a more geographically diverse conference. If we had a partner shop, our community would get behind bringing us together for a conference as well.
-Andy
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 11:33 AM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Angel,
" I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference."
One thing I think we want to avoid is setting up a caste system of people who pay and people who volunteer (indentured servants). At BikeBike everyone should be volunteers, it's a conference of problem solvers, and we can all come together to make it happen. No one is making money, so it should be on the conference as a whole to take on the work. One of the main goals should be to help build something and leave the city and the collective in better shape than we found it.
"Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment"
I don't disagree with anything you said, and we may want to think about the environmental impact of people traveling from all over the country (BTW driving alone in a car <9 hours has less impact than flying on a full plane the same distance). I however have gone to a few B!B!SEs (South East) and it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models. Especially in a region that is still heavily segregated(I did miss the B!B!SE in Atlanta, so I'm sure it was much different there). With this I think it would really benefit folx from the South East to be exposed to ideas of the larger group. Especially the collectivism of Latin America. I would say we could plan on only going to the annual international B!B! if it is in your region, and save money for it for the years it is not. However I think that would rely on the schedule being done a couple years a head. With the life expectancy of Bike Collectives I don't think that is realistic. (If you are from the SE and disagree with me, please let me know. I'm sure folx are working for social justice everywhere.)
My org really doesn't have money to spend on sending volunteers anywhere. We are focused on youth, so if we had money it would probably go towards sending youth to the Youth Bike Summit (YBS) or sending our youth mountain bike team to a meet.
thanks for adding to the conversation, -erk
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 5:48 PM, Angel York aniola@gmail.com wrote:
I really like this idea! Here are a couple of thoughts:
- I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise
have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference. Food was included. (I was really impressed by OSB conference; more details on the ways they focused on equity available if you're interested)
- I was able to attend a Bici! Bici! in Southern California once
because our bike collective paid the bus fare to travel for the only two people interested to travel all the way from Northern California. It was a great experience, and I still remember it years later.
- I have never been to Bike! Bike!, but I've attended a couple
regional Bici! Bici!s, because, in addition to the hardship of buying a ticket to a faraway place, I am a person who values being able to transport myself by bike, as I would expect some non-attendees are, and I have trouble getting past the environmental barrier of traveling such a long distance, even for what I know to be an amazing event with people I'd love to meet, see again, get to know, share with, learn from.
Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment.
Angel York
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 2:42 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey y'all,
I have been throwing around ideas about travel equity after our trip to Mexico. For me a citizen of the US it was easy to get down there and was very affordable. I started thinking about why that was, and how it doesn't apply to everybody. Below is some suggestions that I have come up with. Most of these suggestions would really be up to the BikeBike hosts (Detroit in 2016), but the travel fund could be something we could start easily with donations. It is a rough draft and I'm looking for feedback (there has only been 5 minutes of feedback so far). Most of these ideas would take a bit of work, but I think it would be worth it to allow as many people to participate in BikeBike as possible.
let me/us know what you think, erk
BikeBike Travel Equity:
Suggestions to Offset Inequitable Travel Cost and Barriers
Summary: In an aim to make BikeBike more inclusive we should help address travel inequities. Travel can be much harder/more expensive depending on what side of some imaginary lines a person was born on or what system they have to live in. We should encourage those with privilege to help those with less.
- Registration: registration fees should be very malleable. Folx
that can pay more should be encouraged to support folx that cannot.
a. For some participants the registration fee is very cheap for all the services provided, others it may be a large expense.
- Travel funds should be created ahead of time to help folx with
Visas/other travel expenses.
a. Donations or excess registration fees could create these funds.
b. Example of need: A Mexican Citizen needs to pay $300 USD just to apply for a visa to the USA. If they do not get approved they do not get the money back. For a US citizen with steady work this might not seem like a huge loss, but that works out to $5,100 MEX, which could be 3 or 4 times a person’s monthly housing cost.
- 3 meals (and snacks) a day at BikeBike.
a. Eatting out is by default expensive, but if you come from a country with an unfavorable currency exchange it is even more so. Even without that exchange, some people don’t have money to blow on a luxury like eating out.
b. This creates a bit more work, visiting BikeBikers should be encouraged to help cook and take any other loads off the hosts.
c. An alternative may be providing access to the kitchen when meals cannot be provided.
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Thanks everyone for addressing this issue and here's what I think: as a Mexican citizen, going to Bike!Bike! has been an absolutely life changing experience and if it wasn't for Bicitekas (the organization that I was working for when I first attended Bike!Bike! in 2012), I wouldn't have been able to go. Bicitekas, as opposed to most of the bike collectives in Mexico, receive funding from many sources because they are not an actual community bike shop, they are a bike advocacy organization that started a community space after someone traveled to LA and saw the Bike Kitchen and wanted to start something like that, and up to this day, the community space is not their strongest project, nor it has any money to send someone to Detroit if it was going to happen today.
Bike collectives in Mexico are still very young and there are not as many funding options as there seem to be in the US or Canada, I cannot even imagine any university from Mexico supporting a space and a project as the one I saw in Vancouver or the one there is in Seattle where I had the chance to live for a little bit, so having this international exchange of experience, people and knowledge I think it's very very important for bike collectives in Mexico and over all South and Central America to gain experience and maybe look more serious to the eyes of those with the money and to actually be part of a (why not) international bike collective network and movement, therefore I absolutely support the idea of having international Bike!Bike! every year and finding sustainable ways to support at least some of those who cannot afford to go.
I do have the privilege to have a US Visa but it was definitely expensive and hard to get. Don't even get me started on the Canadian Visa; to go to B!B! in 2012, I paid around 200 canadian dollars and I only got a visa for two weeks, that was valid for the week of B!B! and seven more days. Years later I had to apply again, pay this time 360 Canadian dollars (more than half of my monthly paycheck, and I make pretty good money for Mexican standards), and they gave me a Visa good for three years thanks to a Canadian citizen that made an invitation letter for me and sent me her birth certificate to prove that she's actually someone I know and that she's in fact, Canadian.
I think we could definitely start to help other folks make this journey a little easier by making invitation letters (I'd be happy to share one I have), finding lawyers or other allies that can make appropriate negotiations to issue visas at least for people to attend the conference, or maybe having an extra fund to pay for some visas so that folks can only focus on saving for air fares, after all, these days one dollar is 17 pesos and minimum wage in Mexico is 70 pesos a day so you kinda have the idea.
I want to thank all of you who came to Guadalajara and who are willing to make the inequity less of an issue for many people who are eager to live the experience of the huge bike collective movement of the US, Canada and other places from which we can all learn a lot.
- Jim
On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 1:42 PM, Andrew Shooner ashooner@gmail.com wrote:
Hey andy I was hesitant to say that cause I knew that I was probably
wrong, it was just a feeling I had with little evidence to back it up. If I could take it back I would.
No worries! As much as I use it every day, I still think email is a tough medium to communicate real ideas through; it takes the humanity out of those you're trying to connect with. Self-censoring your thoughts is just as bad as stepping on someone's feelings, IMHO.
Regardless of specifics, I think you got to a fundamental question: How do we connect shops that have limited resources, but have diverse solutions to working with those resources.
On Tue, Oct 13, 2015 at 7:10 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey andy I was hesitant to say that cause I knew that I was probably wrong, it was just a feeling I had with little evidence to back it up. If I could take it back I would. Anyways a more general "people can benefit from ideas from out side their region" would of worked much better. Sorry for the judgmental statement that did little to add to the conversation and could of turned potential collaborators off. Thanks for not taking offense and actually adding to the conversation.
As for the ideas you mentioned they are great. Right now I feel like all I can do with them is (along with the other great suggestions from the TT and FB) is copy them down and try to organize them in one place until we can get a group of people working on them. Thanks so much.
-erk
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 6:56 PM, Andrew Shooner ashooner@gmail.com wrote:
it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops
that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models.
Hey Erk. I don't think we've met, and I appreciate the discussion. In my experience, this is not accurate. I like the concept of addressing the inequitable access to the community. In terms of access to BikeBike, I think this has a lot of potential. Some brainstorming:
*Travel Grants (independent group)* Very conventional. Probably would need some kind of fiduciary body to manage, then you get into taking and evaluating applications. bleh. One advantage I guess would be that it would probably be the most consistent model.
*Travel Grants (from BikeBike!)* If the grants were connected to the bikebike conference itself, and was either a mandatory or optional part of the registration fee, that could be an effective fundraising effort. This might require a bit more lead-time in the BikeBike conference organization, though. Also, I don't know who that would work financially.
*Partner Shops* Two or more shops/collectives distant from each other get paired up, and they pool their resources to send/bring one or more from each team to the national conference. This could be cool b/c it is way more interpersonal and organic. Would need to watch out for this becoming a paternal 'adopt-a-shop' scenario. It would be better for similar shops (economically, constituents, mission) rather than one supporting the other. I like this idea in that it can lead to new attendees breaking out of the comfort zone of their team and interacting more with the broader community.
From the perspective of my shop (Broke Spoke, Lex KY), we'd probably find plenty of support in either of those scenarios. We'd be more than happy to pay a fee that went to creating a more geographically diverse conference. If we had a partner shop, our community would get behind bringing us together for a conference as well.
-Andy
On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 11:33 AM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Angel,
" I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference."
One thing I think we want to avoid is setting up a caste system of people who pay and people who volunteer (indentured servants). At BikeBike everyone should be volunteers, it's a conference of problem solvers, and we can all come together to make it happen. No one is making money, so it should be on the conference as a whole to take on the work. One of the main goals should be to help build something and leave the city and the collective in better shape than we found it.
"Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment"
I don't disagree with anything you said, and we may want to think about the environmental impact of people traveling from all over the country (BTW driving alone in a car <9 hours has less impact than flying on a full plane the same distance). I however have gone to a few B!B!SEs (South East) and it seems that the trend there is bike Co-Ops with members and Co-Ops that are semi-for-profit (or at least focus on sales). Personally these do not seem like a very inclusive models. Especially in a region that is still heavily segregated(I did miss the B!B!SE in Atlanta, so I'm sure it was much different there). With this I think it would really benefit folx from the South East to be exposed to ideas of the larger group. Especially the collectivism of Latin America. I would say we could plan on only going to the annual international B!B! if it is in your region, and save money for it for the years it is not. However I think that would rely on the schedule being done a couple years a head. With the life expectancy of Bike Collectives I don't think that is realistic. (If you are from the SE and disagree with me, please let me know. I'm sure folx are working for social justice everywhere.)
My org really doesn't have money to spend on sending volunteers anywhere. We are focused on youth, so if we had money it would probably go towards sending youth to the Youth Bike Summit (YBS) or sending our youth mountain bike team to a meet.
thanks for adding to the conversation, -erk
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 5:48 PM, Angel York aniola@gmail.com wrote:
I really like this idea! Here are a couple of thoughts:
- I attended a couple conferences recently that I wouldn't otherwise
have been able to attend by signing up to volunteer at each conference. Food was included. (I was really impressed by OSB conference; more details on the ways they focused on equity available if you're interested)
- I was able to attend a Bici! Bici! in Southern California once
because our bike collective paid the bus fare to travel for the only two people interested to travel all the way from Northern California. It was a great experience, and I still remember it years later.
- I have never been to Bike! Bike!, but I've attended a couple
regional Bici! Bici!s, because, in addition to the hardship of buying a ticket to a faraway place, I am a person who values being able to transport myself by bike, as I would expect some non-attendees are, and I have trouble getting past the environmental barrier of traveling such a long distance, even for what I know to be an amazing event with people I'd love to meet, see again, get to know, share with, learn from.
Personally, I believe that bike collectives have grown enough to the point where there are enough organizations that there can be a stronger focus on cohering the regional bike bikes and the zine zine (hey, any more info forthcoming with that?), with the centralized international bike bike happening only once every 3-5 years in the name of giving people with low incomes and collectives who want to send some core volunteers the time to save up to attend, and to reduce the impact of long-distance travel on the environment.
Angel York
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 2:42 PM, erk magosh emailmyremail@gmail.com wrote:
Hey y'all,
I have been throwing around ideas about travel equity after our trip to Mexico. For me a citizen of the US it was easy to get down there and was very affordable. I started thinking about why that was, and how it doesn't apply to everybody. Below is some suggestions that I have come up with. Most of these suggestions would really be up to the BikeBike hosts (Detroit in 2016), but the travel fund could be something we could start easily with donations. It is a rough draft and I'm looking for feedback (there has only been 5 minutes of feedback so far). Most of these ideas would take a bit of work, but I think it would be worth it to allow as many people to participate in BikeBike as possible.
let me/us know what you think, erk
BikeBike Travel Equity:
Suggestions to Offset Inequitable Travel Cost and Barriers
Summary: In an aim to make BikeBike more inclusive we should help address travel inequities. Travel can be much harder/more expensive depending on what side of some imaginary lines a person was born on or what system they have to live in. We should encourage those with privilege to help those with less.
- Registration: registration fees should be very malleable. Folx
that can pay more should be encouraged to support folx that cannot.
a. For some participants the registration fee is very cheap for all the services provided, others it may be a large expense.
- Travel funds should be created ahead of time to help folx with
Visas/other travel expenses.
a. Donations or excess registration fees could create these funds.
b. Example of need: A Mexican Citizen needs to pay $300 USD just to apply for a visa to the USA. If they do not get approved they do not get the money back. For a US citizen with steady work this might not seem like a huge loss, but that works out to $5,100 MEX, which could be 3 or 4 times a person’s monthly housing cost.
- 3 meals (and snacks) a day at BikeBike.
a. Eatting out is by default expensive, but if you come from a country with an unfavorable currency exchange it is even more so. Even without that exchange, some people don’t have money to blow on a luxury like eating out.
b. This creates a bit more work, visiting BikeBikers should be encouraged to help cook and take any other loads off the hosts.
c. An alternative may be providing access to the kitchen when meals cannot be provided.
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Andrew Shooner -
Angel York -
DancesWithCars -
erk magosh -
Jim!! -
Lauren Warbeck -
Malagodi, Chuck H. -
Randi Park -
Stephen Andruski