Hello everybody,
I've been mulling over a lot of ideas lately about overthrowing the male domination of bicycle co-ops, collectives, recycleries, mechanics, and the industry in general.
Are there any non-males out there who would be interested in discussing strategies to whoop the shit out of male privilege? I'd like to set an email list up for this purpose, but in the meantime, please email me: the.attica@gmail.com
Thanks, andrea
On 28-Oct-09, at 5:49 PM, Bike City wrote:
Hello everybody,
I've been mulling over a lot of ideas lately about overthrowing the
male domination of bicycle co-ops, collectives, recycleries, mechanics, and the industry in general.Are there any non-males out there who would be interested in
discussing strategies to whoop the shit out of male privilege? I'd like to set an email list up for this purpose, but in the meantime, please email me: the.attica@gmail.comThanks, andrea
While the tone of this makes it sound like there's some sort of
conspiracy (and maybe there is and no one told me about it), as a
male I'd personally be interested in what you come up with.
In my other life I'm a musician, and we generally have a history of
non-discrimination; you can be male / female / white / black /
disabled / whatever - we don't care as long as you can do the gig.
Based on that, I've been kind of surprised that our shop has never
been able to recruit an experienced female mechanic. Women are of
course involved with our shop, both as staff and as customers, and I
would say at least half of our bike purchasers and a third of our do-
it-yourselfers.
I guess the lack is due to so few women mechanics in general. And is
this is a cultural thing (usual suspects of "women are less likely to
be mechanically inclined / do not want to get their hands dirty",
etc.) or is it deeper than that? Is there a bias? Is there gender
discrimination? I imagine that there is, though the idealist in me
is appalled at that.
If you can change the status quo I'm all for it!
Mark
Hi
I think you guys are asking some big questions here and touching on some deep issues. That is great. Examining privilege is one of the first steps we take to dismantling it.
My first suggestion is to check out your local library and check out the section on feminism and women's studies. There are a lot of great books on this topic. I love bell hooks, and I'm guessing if you are doing this work, you'll like her too. She is anti-establishment, anti-government and provides a great analysis of these issues.
I'm also offering to talk to you over email one on one. this can be a big topic for a lot of women. To talk about it can be painful and a bit awkward, and it also might bring up a lot of feelings many of us would like to ignore. Feel free to ask a non-male who works a lot in a community bike shop what her experiences are like and how she reacts. Just email me privately.
one example of something that dirves me crazy is when people second guess my work. I am the consistent female mechanics and I haven't seen this happen a lot with the guys. The other week in my own shop, I had a male volunteer whom I hadn't seen in awhile, stand over my shoulder when I was working with someone and tell me how to repack a bottom bracket. I don't think he remembers when I taught him how to repack a bottom bracket, or when I was done teaching him, he grabbed another guy to make sure we had done it right. I wanted to hit him with the wrench I was holding, but instead I asked him to finish the project and I went and started cleaning up. I didn't want to deal with it or address it at the moment, especially with a client right there.
anyway, cheers Carolyn
www.troybikerescue.org "When shall we live if not now?" - M.F.K. Fisher
--- On Wed, 10/28/09, Mark Rehder mark@re-cycles.ca wrote:
From: Mark Rehder mark@re-cycles.ca Subject: Re: [TheThinkTank] Non-male-only bicycle projects To: info@bikecityrecyclery.org, "The Think Tank" thethinktank@bikecollectives.org Date: Wednesday, October 28, 2009, 8:40 PM
On 28-Oct-09, at 5:49 PM, Bike City wrote:
Hello everybody,
I've been mulling over a lot of ideas lately about overthrowing the male domination of bicycle co-ops, collectives, recycleries, mechanics, and the industry in general.
Are there any non-males out there who would be interested in discussing strategies to whoop the shit out of male privilege? I'd like to set an email list up for this purpose, but in the meantime, please email me: the.attica@gmail.com
Thanks, andrea
While the tone of this makes it sound like there's some sort of conspiracy (and maybe there is and no one told me about it), as a male I'd personally be interested in what you come up with.
In my other life I'm a musician, and we generally have a history of non-discrimination; you can be male / female / white / black / disabled / whatever - we don't care as long as you can do the gig.
Based on that, I've been kind of surprised that our shop has never been able to recruit an experienced female mechanic. Women are of course involved with our shop, both as staff and as customers, and I would say at least half of our bike purchasers and a third of our do-it-yourselfers.
I guess the lack is due to so few women mechanics in general. And is this is a cultural thing (usual suspects of "women are less likely to be mechanically inclined / do not want to get their hands dirty", etc.) or is it deeper than that? Is there a bias? Is there gender discrimination? I imagine that there is, though the idealist in me is appalled at that.
If you can change the status quo I'm all for it!
Mark _______________________________________________ Thethinktank mailing list Thethinktank@bikecollectives.org To unsubscribe, send a blank email to TheThinkTank-leave@bikecollectives.org To manage your subscription, plase visit: http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.o...
*My own two cents: I am also interested in having a female mechanic as part of our organization's efforts to sustain and support the bike culture. I've cast out the net to pretty much any woman who comes through the shop and am still waiting for the right person.
I know that from 25 years in the industry, I have unfortunately met only a couple of woman(womyn?) mechanics. I also have 11 years of professional welding experience. I've met a few killer woman welders. Women have HUGE hand/eye coordination advantages over men. It surprises me that there aren't more women welders as well. I do remember an ad campaign from Lightspeed titanium years ago that showed off their lead welder who was a woman(don't recall her name).
My best classes for mechanics' trainings have been mostly or all women. Much more generous in their sharing of their ignorance, curiosity, and wonder than men, although, not all men. They also are more adept at sharing cheese and crackers, bread, fruit, and wine! Prosit!
Any women in the Greater Lehigh Valley, Allentown, Bethlehem, Easton, PA. area give a shout out if you want to anchor bike culture in our area!
All comments welcome!
Frank Pavlick Car Free CAT www.car-free.org bbc@car-free.org
On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 11:40 PM, Mark Rehder mark@re-cycles.ca wrote:
On 28-Oct-09, at 5:49 PM, Bike City wrote:
Hello everybody,
I've been mulling over a lot of ideas lately about overthrowing the male domination of bicycle co-ops, collectives, recycleries, mechanics, and the industry in general.
Are there any non-males out there who would be interested in discussing strategies to whoop the shit out of male privilege? I'd like to set an email list up for this purpose, but in the meantime, please email me: the.attica@gmail.com
Thanks, andrea
While the tone of this makes it sound like there's some sort of conspiracy (and maybe there is and no one told me about it), as a male I'd personally be interested in what you come up with.
In my other life I'm a musician, and we generally have a history of non-discrimination; you can be male / female / white / black / disabled / whatever - we don't care as long as you can do the gig.
Based on that, I've been kind of surprised that our shop has never been able to recruit an experienced female mechanic. Women are of course involved with our shop, both as staff and as customers, and I would say at least half of our bike purchasers and a third of our do-it-yourselfers.
I guess the lack is due to so few women mechanics in general. And is this is a cultural thing (usual suspects of "women are less likely to be mechanically inclined / do not want to get their hands dirty", etc.) or is it deeper than that? Is there a bias? Is there gender discrimination? I imagine that there is, though the idealist in me is appalled at that.
If you can change the status quo I'm all for it!
Mark
Thethinktank mailing list Thethinktank@bikecollectives.org To unsubscribe, send a blank email to TheThinkTank-leave@bikecollectives.org To manage your subscription, plase visit:
http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.o...
I'd be interested, too.
I can tell it's a complicated, multiple-causation thing, but beyond that I'm only beginning to understand.
Young girls seem to have less exposure to basic technologies (wrenches, screws, hammers) than boys. Perhaps because of this, later in life, if exposed to more complex technologies (lathes, mills, cars, bike drivetrains), women are more likely to be uncomfortable, and more likely to be frightened, than their male counterparts. There's less comfort with the terminology, which makes it harder to deeply integrate into a class or a peer group. If you've never used an allen wrench, it's hard to talk about how to fix a bike.
These are the broadest of generalizations, but they're what I've found when trying to understand why there are so few women in the welding/machining/renewable energy classes I take.
Fear is a great and powerful thing. Things like welding and working on cars are best practiced with a healthy amount of fear of the process. Being too comfortable is a dangerous thing, literally.
So, when I was running a small non-profit fabrication shop, I made a conscious effort to scare new people when showing them the ropes. If this person was ever going to wield an oxy-acetylene torch in our shop, the lives of everyone there would be in their hands. I didn't want them thinking this was a thing to be taken lightly. Maybe this is the wrong approach, but it is a common one. I wonder how many people have been scared off by it.
Whom to blame? I dunno. Don't immediately blame the people in charge of hiring--they may just be hiring the people who present themselves. I know a couple bike shops that've been looking for a decent non-male wrench for a long time.
Me personally, I judge a mechanic on the quality of their work, not what's in their pants. I like to think that's becoming more universal, not less.
Ethan Labowitz http://bikebuilding.blogspot.com
On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 11:40 PM, Mark Rehder mark@re-cycles.ca wrote:
On 28-Oct-09, at 5:49 PM, Bike City wrote:
Hello everybody,
I've been mulling over a lot of ideas lately about overthrowing the male domination of bicycle co-ops, collectives, recycleries, mechanics, and the industry in general.
Are there any non-males out there who would be interested in discussing strategies to whoop the shit out of male privilege? I'd like to set an email list up for this purpose, but in the meantime, please email me: the.attica@gmail.com
Thanks, andrea
While the tone of this makes it sound like there's some sort of conspiracy (and maybe there is and no one told me about it), as a male I'd personally be interested in what you come up with.
In my other life I'm a musician, and we generally have a history of non-discrimination; you can be male / female / white / black / disabled / whatever - we don't care as long as you can do the gig.
Based on that, I've been kind of surprised that our shop has never been able to recruit an experienced female mechanic. Women are of course involved with our shop, both as staff and as customers, and I would say at least half of our bike purchasers and a third of our do-it-yourselfers.
I guess the lack is due to so few women mechanics in general. And is this is a cultural thing (usual suspects of "women are less likely to be mechanically inclined / do not want to get their hands dirty", etc.) or is it deeper than that? Is there a bias? Is there gender discrimination? I imagine that there is, though the idealist in me is appalled at that.
If you can change the status quo I'm all for it!
Mark _______________________________________________ Thethinktank mailing list Thethinktank@bikecollectives.org To unsubscribe, send a blank email to TheThinkTank-leave@bikecollectives.org To manage your subscription, plase visit: http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.o...
At the Bike Church (Santa Cruz), we actively encourage females already in the space to start volunteering - fully intending on later recruiting them to become mechanics/core members of the collective. Personally, when I speak to females while trying to recruit them, I'm very upfront about our desire to have more women in the shop. I try to allude to my personal feelings that without some sort of gender balance we, as a community space, are incomplete. I hope that it translates and makes them feel valued.
A fellow mechanic walked through the office as I was typing this, and he said that BICAS, who has employees rather than volunteers, has a *policy* of having at least one woman per shift. He also mentioned that, within our society, women are some what demotivated to learn mechanical skills because of the lack of potential long term compensation. When a male is learning mechanical skills in a community bike shop, he is learning a skill set that he can use as a machinist, carpenter, or bike tech in another shop. A woman is less likely to be offered or take those positions, so there is less motivation for them to learn skills that may not have further applications beyond the community shop or their own personal bicycle.
I really encourage shops to have internal conversations about the topic. It may not get far, but it's important to begin the process. AND, it's important for male mechanics to really listen to what female mechanics have to say. A strong sense of empathy only goes so far guys. At some point, you have to stop, listen, and defer to what they're feeling. -Adam
On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 2:49 PM, Bike City bikecityrecyclery@gmail.comwrote:
Hello everybody,
I've been mulling over a lot of ideas lately about overthrowing the male domination of bicycle co-ops, collectives, recycleries, mechanics, and the industry in general.
Are there any non-males out there who would be interested in discussing strategies to whoop the shit out of male privilege? I'd like to set an email list up for this purpose, but in the meantime, please email me: the.attica@gmail.com
Thanks, andrea
Thethinktank mailing list Thethinktank@bikecollectives.org To unsubscribe, send a blank email to TheThinkTank-leave@bikecollectives.org To manage your subscription, plase visit:
http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.o...
While not a community bike program, when I worked at REI in Virginia I taught many intro and advanced bike classes which seemed to be male dominated or male only. The classes were open to everyone, but I believe women were not comfortable in that community coming to these classes based upon past experiences, possibly in mixed gender mechanical settings - many of my female customers would reinforce the gender discrimination I experienced in the race scene and shops at which I've worked in the past. I wrote and taught a women's only bike mechanics workshop that received very strong responses. Women were more comfortable asking questions (and arguing points) when men weren't around. When I moved to Boston to run a shop up here, I found that the classes were more gender balanced. I offered the idea of a women's only class series to customers and class attendees, few of whom expressed interest. One of them told me "we don't have any problems with men being there."
Sure, political climate of the areas may factor in. More importantly the bicycle culture in Northern Virginia is way behind the strength and saturation of the culture in the Boston area. That being said, while working at a bike shop in Boston as a green mechanic, the owner had one of the more experienced female mechanics re-stock socks and sweep the floors while he asked me to do repairs. I explained I was not comfortable doing the task at hand, and he told me to try. The other male mechanics would frequently ostracize the female staff trying to do repair work (some of whom handled it better than others). The owner explained to me that when high powered businessmen come in with their expensive bikes, after spending the day surrounded by male clients and colleagues they expect a guy to fix their bike, and it reflects poorly to have a woman in the shop.
I don't work at that shop anymore (didn't for much longer after that went down) but there is certainly that programming in cycling culture to work against. That poor attitude has also cost that shop many customers. Many shops in Boston are better than that, but it takes community programs (and their gender sensitivity) to remind cycling culture that communities exist of more than old boy's clubs.
Scott
On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 7:46 PM, Bike Church thebikechurch@gmail.comwrote:
At the Bike Church (Santa Cruz), we actively encourage females already in the space to start volunteering - fully intending on later recruiting them to become mechanics/core members of the collective. Personally, when I speak to females while trying to recruit them, I'm very upfront about our desire to have more women in the shop. I try to allude to my personal feelings that without some sort of gender balance we, as a community space, are incomplete. I hope that it translates and makes them feel valued.
A fellow mechanic walked through the office as I was typing this, and he said that BICAS, who has employees rather than volunteers, has a *policy*of having at least one woman per shift. He also mentioned that, within our society, women are some what demotivated to learn mechanical skills because of the lack of potential long term compensation. When a male is learning mechanical skills in a community bike shop, he is learning a skill set that he can use as a machinist, carpenter, or bike tech in another shop. A woman is less likely to be offered or take those positions, so there is less motivation for them to learn skills that may not have further applications beyond the community shop or their own personal bicycle.
I really encourage shops to have internal conversations about the topic. It may not get far, but it's important to begin the process. AND, it's important for male mechanics to really listen to what female mechanics have to say. A strong sense of empathy only goes so far guys. At some point, you have to stop, listen, and defer to what they're feeling. -Adam
On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 2:49 PM, Bike City bikecityrecyclery@gmail.comwrote:
Hello everybody,
I've been mulling over a lot of ideas lately about overthrowing the male domination of bicycle co-ops, collectives, recycleries, mechanics, and the industry in general.
Are there any non-males out there who would be interested in discussing strategies to whoop the shit out of male privilege? I'd like to set an email list up for this purpose, but in the meantime, please email me: the.attica@gmail.com
Thanks, andrea
Thethinktank mailing list Thethinktank@bikecollectives.org To unsubscribe, send a blank email to TheThinkTank-leave@bikecollectives.org To manage your subscription, plase visit:
http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.o...
Thethinktank mailing list Thethinktank@bikecollectives.org To unsubscribe, send a blank email to TheThinkTank-leave@bikecollectives.org To manage your subscription, plase visit:
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I have worked in many cities to create youth bicycle education programs. I have taught many adults to become mechanics/ teachers. My best teachers have been women, They asked great questions, they did not act like they knew it all, they worked ethically not taking short cuts or giving less than steller effort. In St louis, Indianapolis, Champaign/ Urbana I have had programs all with great women adding more to the program than they took from it. In Chicago I was teaching youth again but I was teaching more adults. I knew of a program that would let anyone teach classes at their bike shop. I started teacing a few women for free if they made one commitment: to teach other women. Five women took the challenge and created Cycling Sisters. I am very proud to see how many women they have inspired to work on thier own bikes, ride year round, and now ride with thier children. I now work for REI as their Master Tech in down town Chicago, I have only had one woman working in my shop, sadly she got a job as a class room teacher and only works part time for REI now. I am still trying to get more classes in the community room. I also have a program in Oak Park called Holistic Cycles. I am working with Illinois State board of education to create a bicycle school program like United bicycle, or Barnett's. I am looking for great women to teach at my school.
Christopher Wallace
While not a community bike program, when I worked at REI in Virginia I taught many intro and advanced bike classes which seemed to be male dominated or male only. The classes were open to everyone, but I believe women were not comfortable in that community coming to these classes based upon past experiences, possibly in mixed gender mechanical settings - many of my female customers would reinforce the gender discrimination I experienced in the race scene and shops at which I've worked in the past. I wrote and taught a women's only bike mechanics workshop that received very strong responses. Women were more comfortable asking questions (and arguing points) when men weren't around. When I moved to Boston to run a shop up here, I found that the classes were more gender balanced. I offered the idea of a women's only class series to customers and class attendees, few of whom expressed interest. One of them told me "we don't have any problems with men being there."
Sure, political climate of the areas may factor in. More importantly the bicycle culture in Northern Virginia is way behind the strength and saturation of the culture in the Boston area. That being said, while working at a bike shop in Boston as a green mechanic, the owner had one of the more experienced female mechanics re-stock socks and sweep the floors while he asked me to do repairs. I explained I was not comfortable doing the task at hand, and he told me to try. The other male mechanics would frequently ostracize the female staff trying to do repair work (some of whom handled it better than others). The owner explained to me that when high powered businessmen come in with their expensive bikes, after spending the day surrounded by male clients and colleagues they expect a guy to fix their bike, and it reflects poorly to have a woman in the shop.
I don't work at that shop anymore (didn't for much longer after that went down) but there is certainly that programming in cycling culture to work against. That poor attitude has also cost that shop many customers. Many shops in Boston are better than that, but it takes community programs (and their gender sensitivity) to remind cycling culture that communities exist of more than old boy's clubs.
Scott
On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 7:46 PM, Bike Church thebikechurch@gmail.com wrote:
At the Bike Church (Santa Cruz), we actively encourage females already in the space to start volunteering - fully intending on later recruiting them to become mechanics/core members of the collective. Personally, when I speak to females while trying to recruit them, I'm very upfront about our desire to have more women in the shop. I try to allude to my personal feelings that without some sort of gender balance we, as a community space, are incomplete. I hope that it translates and makes them feel valued.
A fellow mechanic walked through the office as I was typing this, and he said that BICAS, who has employees rather than volunteers, has a policy of having at least one woman per shift. He also mentioned that, within our society, women are some what demotivated to learn mechanical skills because of the lack of potential long term compensation. When a male is learning mechanical skills in a community bike shop, he is learning a skill set that he can use as a machinist, carpenter, or bike tech in another shop. A woman is less likely to be offered or take those positions, so there is less motivation for them to learn skills that may not have further applications beyond the community shop or their own personal bicycle.
I really encourage shops to have internal conversations about the topic. It may not get far, but it's important to begin the process. AND, it's important for male mechanics to really listen to what female mechanics have to say. A strong sense of empathy only goes so far guys. At some point, you have to stop, listen, and defer to what they're feeling. -Adam
On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 2:49 PM, Bike City bikecityrecyclery@gmail.com wrote:
Hello everybody,
I've been mulling over a lot of ideas lately about overthrowing the male domination of bicycle co-ops, collectives, recycleries, mechanics, and the industry in general.
Are there any non-males out there who would be interested in discussing strategies to whoop the shit out of male privilege? I'd like to set an email list up for this purpose, but in the meantime, please email me: the.attica@gmail.com
Thanks, andrea
Thethinktank mailing list Thethinktank@bikecollectives.org To unsubscribe, send a blank email to TheThinkTank-leave@bikecollectives.org To manage your subscription, plase visit: http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.o...
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why would you want to do that?
men rule!
On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 1:49 PM, Bike City bikecityrecyclery@gmail.comwrote:
Hello everybody,
I've been mulling over a lot of ideas lately about overthrowing the male domination of bicycle co-ops, collectives, recycleries, mechanics, and the industry in general.
Are there any non-males out there who would be interested in discussing strategies to whoop the shit out of male privilege? I'd like to set an email list up for this purpose, but in the meantime, please email me: the.attica@gmail.com
Thanks, andrea
Thethinktank mailing list Thethinktank@bikecollectives.org To unsubscribe, send a blank email to TheThinkTank-leave@bikecollectives.org To manage your subscription, plase visit:
http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.o...
This is a great group which includes the bicycle industry: Outdoor Industries Women's Coalition: http://www.oiwc.org/
I took the liberty of searching for members in AR, and see that Susan Robideaux might be your local contact. She is either the VP or owns HipJack, I can't tell. But I would contact her, she can at least point you in the right direction.
HIPJACK LLC 4362 W. FLAGSTICK FAYETTEVILLE, AR 72704
Sincerely,
Jonathan Morrison Executive Director Salt Lake City Bicycle Collective 2312 S. West Temple Salt Lake City, UT 84115 w: 801-328-2453 c: 801-688-0183 f: 801-466-3856 www.slcbikecollective.org
The mission of the Salt Lake City Bicycle Collective is to promote cycling as an effective and sustainable form of transportation and as a cornerstone of a cleaner, healthier, and safer society. The Bicycle Collective provides refurbished bicycles and educational programs to the community, focusing on children and lower income households.
On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 2:49 PM, Bike City bikecityrecyclery@gmail.comwrote:
Hello everybody,
I've been mulling over a lot of ideas lately about overthrowing the male domination of bicycle co-ops, collectives, recycleries, mechanics, and the industry in general.
Are there any non-males out there who would be interested in discussing strategies to whoop the shit out of male privilege? I'd like to set an email list up for this purpose, but in the meantime, please email me: the.attica@gmail.com
Thanks, andrea
Thethinktank mailing list Thethinktank@bikecollectives.org To unsubscribe, send a blank email to TheThinkTank-leave@bikecollectives.org To manage your subscription, plase visit:
http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.o...
participants (10)
-
Bike Church -
Bike City -
bovineoaks＠aol.com -
Carolyn Braunius -
Ethan Labowitz -
Frank Pavlick -
Jonathan Morrison -
Mark Rehder -
reno bikes -
Scott McGuillicutty