Focus on education or D.I.Y.?
Forgive the long email, please!
With respect to workshops where the public can repair their own bikes:
Does your organization perceive and market your workshops as being more about
A) learning bike maintenance (particularly basic skills, i.e. most people come to learn) or B) an opportunity to use tools and equipment to do it yourself and save money (it's "ok" (tolerable?) if you don't know much)
I imagine many reading this will want to answer "both" or more probably "both and much more". My thinking about this until now has basically just been "both and much more". The answer must vary depending on location, demographics served, the size and proportion of bicycle users in your area, the nature of your local cycling culture, etc.
Here in beautiful Orange County, our visitors are from diverse backgrounds but they almost all come with very little knowledge of how to repair their bikes and a strong majority want to learn more (I don't have survey statistics or anything, this is just based on talking with people at workshops).
This has me realizing that my group might bring more people in and clarify our purpose if we were to emphasize the learning aspect. This can have significant impact in terms of the primary wording of our flyers, the staffing of our workshops, the descriptions of our workshops, even the visual styling of our materials. It might shift our focus in terms of our target audience. Off the bat, I think it implies we should continue to present ourselves as an organization with broad appeal and strive to improve in this regard.
In other words, conceptualizing things more as "come learn how to integrate bikes into your life" and not so centrally "come work on your bike using shared tools and used parts with the help of volunteers because its cheap and more fun and the capitalist exchange economy is destructive, etc."
I believe the latter statement is valid. I also recognize bike co-ops are often complex organizations that serve many purposes and have a variety of symbiotic elements.
However, to return the focus specifically to do-it-together bike repair, I'm just getting a strong feeling that we should be presenting ourselves as "Learning with a repair side effect" rather than "Repair with a learning side effect". Some might object to putting one before the other, but, again, I've been feeling that the reality of what people are looking for when they come to us and other stuff like the task of describing what we do is sort of calling for a priority to be chosen.
I believe that if "learning" is put completely front and center, then you are sending a very clear message that people with few skills are totally welcome. I guess this is the meat of what I'm getting at. It helps take away ALL anxieties people might have about not knowing stuff about bikes. It makes it very clear that no humiliation awaits you if you come to a workshop and need step-by-step assistance. It also makes it clearer to ourselves that we need plenty of able volunteers to facilitate learning. It might furthermore give the other volunteers a clearer picture of their purpose at workshops, and they might even find the teaching part more inspiring than merely repairing bikes.
I think this connects with maintaining a more "mainstreamed" appeal if we see that we are serving people of all kinds and creeds, and being welcoming toward beginners rather than bring more of a clubhouse for the initiated. This doesn't involve a major shift or wholesale whitewashing, but perhaps points toward the importance of doing all we can to keep things clean, organized, attractive (while still feeling free to express diverse opinions and tastes). Perhaps this balance between maintaining an uncomplicated welcoming atmosphere yet not suppressing the free expression of a co-op's regulars, volunteers, and staff is another discussion.
I'd really like to know people's thoughts and definitely experiences with the learning-beginner/D.I.Y-initiated dynamic. For example, has anyone shifted their marketing/mission/image one way or the other (or honed down this image) and noticed any changes? Did this shift in image occur as a response to changes in clientele, or an improvement in assessing their needs?
Supplementary thoughts: one concern is presenting too much of an image of being "for beginners" and turning off people with more experience. Another concern is not clearly communicating that people can actually repair their bikes, not just learn about doing it. Also, these thoughts come in conjunction with our group getting more involved in bike advocacy and also doing more bike rides (potentially getting League Certified Instructors involved), so that we can be a bit of a "one stop shop" for people looking to improve and increase their bicycle use.
I hope this wasn't too much thinking out loud, I'd really love to hear any experiences with this stuff, because we are making some significant changes and opening a shop in half a year or so and I'd like to have our energies properly focused.
Thank you,
Paul Nagel The Bicycle Tree P.O. Box 11293 Santa Ana, CA 92711 http://www.thebicycletree.org info@thebicycletree.org
Paul,
I'm totally with you and much of our focus has shifted in this direction, to the point where we are offering as many hours of structured education as we are Open Workshop. Most weeks, depending on class schedule, we are open 6 days a week. This is a huge shift from 3 years ago when we had no classes at all.
/"//I think this connects with maintaining a more "mainstreamed" appeal if we see that we are serving people of all kinds and creeds, and being welcoming toward beginners rather than bring more of a clubhouse for the initiated."
/We had a divisive (combative) restructuring of Plan B a few years ago. On one side were a group of people that felt that "We have the right to be exclusionary" (a direct quote). My response was that elitism had no place in a community bike project. It says community right on the front door, and I suppose it all depends of what your interpretation of "community" is. Thankfully, the "volunteers" that showed up drunk and rarely and that were protesting inclusion and accountability quickly gave up the fight. The clubhouse mentality is shittyand is in direct opposition of creating any kind of real social change or impact. Asa consequence, those of us that remained vowed to become as equally welcoming to the spandex clad bike jock as we were to the service worker in need of transportation as we were to the crusty bike punk.
Personally, I'd rather be viewed as "Mainstream" or a "sellout"than have the work of a community organization be completely decimated by exclusionary practices that would impact different communities, including marginalized and oppressed ones.
Thanks for writing this; it felt nice to see a lot of what I've been internalizing expressed in print. Kepp up the good work!
PS. Come to Bike!Bike! 2013 in New Orleans. Woot!
Victor Pizarro Project Organizer Plan B, The New Orleans Community Bike Project
On 6/7/2013 2:11 AM, Paul Nagel wrote:
Forgive the long email, please!
With respect to workshops where the public can repair their own bikes:
Does your organization perceive and market your workshops as being more about
A) *learning* bike maintenance (particularly basic skills, i.e. most people come to learn) or B) an opportunity to use tools and equipment to *do it yourself* and save money (it's "ok" (tolerable?) if you don't know much)
I imagine many reading this will want to answer "both" or more probably "both and much more". My thinking about this until now has basically just been "both and much more". The answer must vary depending on location, demographics served, the size and proportion of bicycle users in your area, the nature of your local cycling culture, etc.
Here in beautiful Orange County, our visitors are from diverse backgrounds but they almost all come with very little knowledge of how to repair their bikes and a strong majority want to learn more (I don't have survey statistics or anything, this is just based on talking with people at workshops).
This has me realizing that my group might bring more people in and clarify our purpose if we were to emphasize the learning aspect. This can have significant impact in terms of the primary wording of our flyers, the staffing of our workshops, the descriptions of our workshops, even the visual styling of our materials. It might shift our focus in terms of our target audience. Off the bat, I think it implies we should continue to present ourselves as an organization with broad appeal and strive to improve in this regard.
In other words, conceptualizing things more as "come learn how to integrate bikes into your life" and not so centrally "come work on your bike using shared tools and used parts with the help of volunteers because its cheap and more fun and the capitalist exchange economy is destructive, etc."
I believe the latter statement is valid. I also recognize bike co-ops are often complex organizations that serve many purposes and have a variety of symbiotic elements.
However, to return the focus specifically to do-it-together bike repair, I'm just getting a strong feeling that we should be presenting ourselves as "Learning with a repair side effect" rather than "Repair with a learning side effect". Some might object to putting one before the other, but, again, I've been feeling that the reality of what people are looking for when they come to us and other stuff like the task of describing what we do is sort of calling for a priority to be chosen.
*I believe that if "learning" is put completely front and center, then you are sending a very clear message that people with few skills are totally welcome.* I guess this is the meat of what I'm getting at. It helps take away ALL anxieties people might have about not knowing stuff about bikes. It makes it very clear that no humiliation awaits you if you come to a workshop and need step-by-step assistance. It also makes it clearer to ourselves that we need plenty of able volunteers to facilitate learning. It might furthermore give the other volunteers a clearer picture of their purpose at workshops, and they might even find the teaching part more inspiring than merely repairing bikes.
I think this connects with maintaining a more "mainstreamed" appeal if we see that we are serving people of all kinds and creeds, and being welcoming toward beginners rather than bring more of a clubhouse for the initiated. This doesn't involve a major shift or wholesale whitewashing, but perhaps points toward the importance of doing all we can to keep things clean, organized, attractive (while still feeling free to express diverse opinions and tastes). Perhaps this balance between maintaining an uncomplicated welcoming atmosphere yet not suppressing the free expression of a co-op's regulars, volunteers, and staff is another discussion.
I'd really like to know people's thoughts and definitely *experiences* with the learning-beginner/D.I.Y-initiated dynamic. For example, has anyone shifted their marketing/mission/image one way or the other (or honed down this image) and noticed any changes? Did this shift in image occur as a response to changes in clientele, or an improvement in assessing their needs?
Supplementary thoughts: one concern is presenting too much of an image of being "for beginners" and turning off people with more experience. Another concern is not clearly communicating that people can actually repair their bikes, not just learn about doing it. Also, these thoughts come in conjunction with our group getting more involved in bike advocacy and also doing more bike rides (potentially getting League Certified Instructors involved), so that we can be a bit of a "one stop shop" for people looking to improve and increase their bicycle use.
I hope this wasn't too much thinking out loud, I'd really love to hear any experiences with this stuff, because we are making some significant changes and opening a shop in half a year or so and I'd like to have our energies properly focused.
Thank you,
Paul Nagel The Bicycle Tree P.O. Box 11293 Santa Ana, CA 92711 http://www.thebicycletree.org info@thebicycletree.org
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well said Paul..
Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 7, 2013, at 3:11 AM, Paul Nagel paul@thebicycletree.org wrote:
Forgive the long email, please!
With respect to workshops where the public can repair their own bikes:
Does your organization perceive and market your workshops as being more about
A) *learning* bike maintenance (particularly basic skills, i.e. most people come to learn) or B) an opportunity to use tools and equipment to *do it yourself* and save money (it's "ok" (tolerable?) if you don't know much)
I imagine many reading this will want to answer "both" or more probably "both and much more". My thinking about this until now has basically just been "both and much more". The answer must vary depending on location, demographics served, the size and proportion of bicycle users in your area, the nature of your local cycling culture, etc.
Here in beautiful Orange County, our visitors are from diverse backgrounds but they almost all come with very little knowledge of how to repair their bikes and a strong majority want to learn more (I don't have survey statistics or anything, this is just based on talking with people at workshops).
This has me realizing that my group might bring more people in and clarify our purpose if we were to emphasize the learning aspect. This can have significant impact in terms of the primary wording of our flyers, the staffing of our workshops, the descriptions of our workshops, even the visual styling of our materials. It might shift our focus in terms of our target audience. Off the bat, I think it implies we should continue to present ourselves as an organization with broad appeal and strive to improve in this regard.
In other words, conceptualizing things more as "come learn how to integrate bikes into your life" and not so centrally "come work on your bike using shared tools and used parts with the help of volunteers because its cheap and more fun and the capitalist exchange economy is destructive, etc."
I believe the latter statement is valid. I also recognize bike co-ops are often complex organizations that serve many purposes and have a variety of symbiotic elements.
However, to return the focus specifically to do-it-together bike repair, I'm just getting a strong feeling that we should be presenting ourselves as "Learning with a repair side effect" rather than "Repair with a learning side effect". Some might object to putting one before the other, but, again, I've been feeling that the reality of what people are looking for when they come to us and other stuff like the task of describing what we do is sort of calling for a priority to be chosen.
*I believe that if "learning" is put completely front and center, then you are sending a very clear message that people with few skills are totally welcome.* I guess this is the meat of what I'm getting at. It helps take away ALL anxieties people might have about not knowing stuff about bikes. It makes it very clear that no humiliation awaits you if you come to a workshop and need step-by-step assistance. It also makes it clearer to ourselves that we need plenty of able volunteers to facilitate learning. It might furthermore give the other volunteers a clearer picture of their purpose at workshops, and they might even find the teaching part more inspiring than merely repairing bikes.
I think this connects with maintaining a more "mainstreamed" appeal if we see that we are serving people of all kinds and creeds, and being welcoming toward beginners rather than bring more of a clubhouse for the initiated. This doesn't involve a major shift or wholesale whitewashing, but perhaps points toward the importance of doing all we can to keep things clean, organized, attractive (while still feeling free to express diverse opinions and tastes). Perhaps this balance between maintaining an uncomplicated welcoming atmosphere yet not suppressing the free expression of a co-op's regulars, volunteers, and staff is another discussion.
I'd really like to know people's thoughts and definitely *experiences* with the learning-beginner/D.I.Y-initiated dynamic. For example, has anyone shifted their marketing/mission/image one way or the other (or honed down this image) and noticed any changes? Did this shift in image occur as a response to changes in clientele, or an improvement in assessing their needs?
Supplementary thoughts: one concern is presenting too much of an image of being "for beginners" and turning off people with more experience. Another concern is not clearly communicating that people can actually repair their bikes, not just learn about doing it. Also, these thoughts come in conjunction with our group getting more involved in bike advocacy and also doing more bike rides (potentially getting League Certified Instructors involved), so that we can be a bit of a "one stop shop" for people looking to improve and increase their bicycle use.
I hope this wasn't too much thinking out loud, I'd really love to hear any experiences with this stuff, because we are making some significant changes and opening a shop in half a year or so and I'd like to have our energies properly focused.
Thank you,
Paul Nagel The Bicycle Tree P.O. Box 11293 Santa Ana, CA 92711 http://www.thebicycletree.org info@thebicycletree.org
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I definitely agree with what you are saying. I don't know how well our promotional materials get across the message, but our workshops are for people to learn AND to apply what they learn on their own bikes. I wrote that workshops are a way to "get the most out of your membership" to our shop, so that you know what you're doing when you come in.
I think bike coops fetishize everything "DIY" and that's cute and all, but when I see a member working on their bike and trying to pound their crank off with a hammer, I wish they would just stop DIYing and read a book or ask questions. The beauty of bike coops is that you can work on your own bike and do your own diagnoses, but you can't and shouldn't do that without the skills. In some sense, the crazy homeless schizophrenic person is not going to do well at workshops, but that is when you offer to do repairs *for
- people who can't do it themselves. But for the average Joe American who
wants to know how to work on his own bike, there is no benefit to bike culture in being elitist. Don't just tell the guy to throw away his Huffy. Teach him WHY he should. What's the point in a collective space where people use tools if they are going to use them incorrectly, break them, break their bikes, and not be able to ride? Everyone loses.
Brett Schager Volunteer and Outreach Coordinator Community Cycles brett@communitycycles.org
On Fri, Jun 7, 2013 at 1:11 AM, Paul Nagel paul@thebicycletree.org wrote:
Forgive the long email, please!
With respect to workshops where the public can repair their own bikes:
Does your organization perceive and market your workshops as being more about
A) *learning* bike maintenance (particularly basic skills, i.e. most people come to learn) or B) an opportunity to use tools and equipment to *do it yourself* and save money (it's "ok" (tolerable?) if you don't know much)
I imagine many reading this will want to answer "both" or more probably "both and much more". My thinking about this until now has basically just been "both and much more". The answer must vary depending on location, demographics served, the size and proportion of bicycle users in your area, the nature of your local cycling culture, etc.
Here in beautiful Orange County, our visitors are from diverse backgrounds but they almost all come with very little knowledge of how to repair their bikes and a strong majority want to learn more (I don't have survey statistics or anything, this is just based on talking with people at workshops).
This has me realizing that my group might bring more people in and clarify our purpose if we were to emphasize the learning aspect. This can have significant impact in terms of the primary wording of our flyers, the staffing of our workshops, the descriptions of our workshops, even the visual styling of our materials. It might shift our focus in terms of our target audience. Off the bat, I think it implies we should continue to present ourselves as an organization with broad appeal and strive to improve in this regard.
In other words, conceptualizing things more as "come learn how to integrate bikes into your life" and not so centrally "come work on your bike using shared tools and used parts with the help of volunteers because its cheap and more fun and the capitalist exchange economy is destructive, etc."
I believe the latter statement is valid. I also recognize bike co-ops are often complex organizations that serve many purposes and have a variety of symbiotic elements.
However, to return the focus specifically to do-it-together bike repair, I'm just getting a strong feeling that we should be presenting ourselves as "Learning with a repair side effect" rather than "Repair with a learning side effect". Some might object to putting one before the other, but, again, I've been feeling that the reality of what people are looking for when they come to us and other stuff like the task of describing what we do is sort of calling for a priority to be chosen.
*I believe that if "learning" is put completely front and center, then you are sending a very clear message that people with few skills are totally welcome.* I guess this is the meat of what I'm getting at. It helps take away ALL anxieties people might have about not knowing stuff about bikes. It makes it very clear that no humiliation awaits you if you come to a workshop and need step-by-step assistance. It also makes it clearer to ourselves that we need plenty of able volunteers to facilitate learning. It might furthermore give the other volunteers a clearer picture of their purpose at workshops, and they might even find the teaching part more inspiring than merely repairing bikes.
I think this connects with maintaining a more "mainstreamed" appeal if we see that we are serving people of all kinds and creeds, and being welcoming toward beginners rather than bring more of a clubhouse for the initiated. This doesn't involve a major shift or wholesale whitewashing, but perhaps points toward the importance of doing all we can to keep things clean, organized, attractive (while still feeling free to express diverse opinions and tastes). Perhaps this balance between maintaining an uncomplicated welcoming atmosphere yet not suppressing the free expression of a co-op's regulars, volunteers, and staff is another discussion.
I'd really like to know people's thoughts and definitely *experiences*with the learning-beginner/D.I.Y-initiated dynamic. For example, has anyone shifted their marketing/mission/image one way or the other (or honed down this image) and noticed any changes? Did this shift in image occur as a response to changes in clientele, or an improvement in assessing their needs?
Supplementary thoughts: one concern is presenting too much of an image of being "for beginners" and turning off people with more experience. Another concern is not clearly communicating that people can actually repair their bikes, not just learn about doing it. Also, these thoughts come in conjunction with our group getting more involved in bike advocacy and also doing more bike rides (potentially getting League Certified Instructors involved), so that we can be a bit of a "one stop shop" for people looking to improve and increase their bicycle use.
I hope this wasn't too much thinking out loud, I'd really love to hear any experiences with this stuff, because we are making some significant changes and opening a shop in half a year or so and I'd like to have our energies properly focused.
Thank you,
Paul Nagel The Bicycle Tree P.O. Box 11293 Santa Ana, CA 92711 http://www.thebicycletree.org info@thebicycletree.org
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Thank you Brett, Vernon, James, and Victor for your thoughtful responses.
At least in my mind, and somewhat in terms of action, we are moving toward being first and foremost a place where people learn a variety of skills necessary to integrate bikes into their daily life. By that I mean we will be leading more and more fun/recreational bike rides (we just did a bike/hike combo in partnership with a naturalist organization, see http://vimeo.com/68024833), and I'm gonna reach out to local league certified cycling instructors in the next few days for doing rides of that sort. We're planning to implement a youth Earn-a-bike and I want to learn from what I've heard people say on here and most definitely include a ride or two as part of that program. In the past our focus was almost entirely mechanical. My feeling is that lacks appeal, fun, and, in our case, effectiveness. I know a lot of coops do rides on a less formal basis, but it seems to make sense to have it be a central and official part of what we do.
There's a fantastic organization about 30 miles from us in Los Angeles called C.I.C.L.E. (http://www.cicle.org/) that I'm sure we could learn a lot from (we actually share fiscal sponsors). They do a lot of what I'm talking about, I think I've seen someone from there post on this list before, if you're out there and see this, hello, and I'm gonna get in contact with you and try to drain your brain! I have no idea why it has taken so many years for it to seep through my thick granitic skull to learn from (and rip off!) what C.I.C.L.E. does.
Us accomplishing all this, of course, will be affected by the volunteers and resources available. I just want to go forward with the right vision and mindset.
-Paul
The Bicycle Tree P.O. Box 11293 Santa Ana, CA 92711 http://www.thebicycletree.org info@thebicycletree.org
From: volunteer@communitycycles.org Date: Sat, 8 Jun 2013 15:30:02 -0600 To: thethinktank@lists.bikecollectives.org Subject: Re: [TheThinkTank] Focus on education or D.I.Y.?
I definitely agree with what you are saying. I don't know how well our promotional materials get across the message, but our workshops are for people to learn AND to apply what they learn on their own bikes. I wrote that workshops are a way to "get the most out of your membership" to our shop, so that you know what you're doing when you come in.
I think bike coops fetishize everything "DIY" and that's cute and all, but when I see a member working on their bike and trying to pound their crank off with a hammer, I wish they would just stop DIYing and read a book or ask questions. The beauty of bike coops is that you can work on your own bike and do your own diagnoses, but you can't and shouldn't do that without the skills. In some sense, the crazy homeless schizophrenic person is not going to do well at workshops, but that is when you offer to do repairs for people who can't do it themselves. But for the average Joe American who wants to know how to work on his own bike, there is no benefit to bike culture in being elitist. Don't just tell the guy to throw away his Huffy. Teach him WHY he should. What's the point in a collective space where people use tools if they are going to use them incorrectly, break them, break their bikes, and not be able to ride? Everyone loses.
Brett Schager Volunteer and Outreach Coordinator Community Cycles brett@communitycycles.org
On Fri, Jun 7, 2013 at 1:11 AM, Paul Nagel paul@thebicycletree.org wrote:
Forgive the long email, please!
With respect to workshops where the public can repair their own bikes:
Does your organization perceive and market your workshops as being more about
A) learning bike maintenance (particularly basic skills, i.e. most people come to learn) or B) an opportunity to use tools and equipment to do it yourself and save money (it's "ok" (tolerable?) if you don't know much)
I imagine many reading this will want to answer "both" or more probably "both and much more". My thinking about this until now has basically just been "both and much more". The answer must vary depending on location, demographics served, the size and proportion of bicycle users in your area, the nature of your local cycling culture, etc.
Here in beautiful Orange County, our visitors are from diverse backgrounds but they almost all come with very little knowledge of how to repair their bikes and a strong majority want to learn more (I don't have survey statistics or anything, this is just based on talking with people at workshops).
This has me realizing that my group might bring more people in and clarify our purpose if we were to emphasize the learning aspect. This can have significant impact in terms of the primary wording of our flyers, the staffing of our workshops, the descriptions of our workshops, even the visual styling of our materials. It might shift our focus in terms of our target audience. Off the bat, I think it implies we should continue to present ourselves as an organization with broad appeal and strive to improve in this regard.
In other words, conceptualizing things more as "come learn how to integrate bikes into your life" and not so centrally "come work on your bike using shared tools and used parts with the help of volunteers because its cheap and more fun and the capitalist exchange economy is destructive, etc."
I believe the latter statement is valid. I also recognize bike co-ops are often complex organizations that serve many purposes and have a variety of symbiotic elements.
However, to return the focus specifically to do-it-together bike repair, I'm just getting a strong feeling that we should be presenting ourselves as "Learning with a repair side effect" rather than "Repair with a learning side effect". Some might object to putting one before the other, but, again, I've been feeling that the reality of what people are looking for when they come to us and other stuff like the task of describing what we do is sort of calling for a priority to be chosen.
I believe that if "learning" is put completely front and center, then you are sending a very clear message that people with few skills are totally welcome. I guess this is the meat of what I'm getting at. It helps take away ALL anxieties people might have about not knowing stuff about bikes. It makes it very clear that no humiliation awaits you if you come to a workshop and need step-by-step assistance. It also makes it clearer to ourselves that we need plenty of able volunteers to facilitate learning. It might furthermore give the other volunteers a clearer picture of their purpose at workshops, and they might even find the teaching part more inspiring than merely repairing bikes.
I think this connects with maintaining a more "mainstreamed" appeal if we see that we are serving people of all kinds and creeds, and being welcoming toward beginners rather than bring more of a clubhouse for the initiated. This doesn't involve a major shift or wholesale whitewashing, but perhaps points toward the importance of doing all we can to keep things clean, organized, attractive (while still feeling free to express diverse opinions and tastes). Perhaps this balance between maintaining an uncomplicated welcoming atmosphere yet not suppressing the free expression of a co-op's regulars, volunteers, and staff is another discussion.
I'd really like to know people's thoughts and definitely experiences with the learning-beginner/D.I.Y-initiated dynamic. For example, has anyone shifted their marketing/mission/image one way or the other (or honed down this image) and noticed any changes? Did this shift in image occur as a response to changes in clientele, or an improvement in assessing their needs?
Supplementary thoughts: one concern is presenting too much of an image of being "for beginners" and turning off people with more experience. Another concern is not clearly communicating that people can actually repair their bikes, not just learn about doing it. Also, these thoughts come in conjunction with our group getting more involved in bike advocacy and also doing more bike rides (potentially getting League Certified Instructors involved), so that we can be a bit of a "one stop shop" for people looking to improve and increase their bicycle use.
I hope this wasn't too much thinking out loud, I'd really love to hear any experiences with this stuff, because we are making some significant changes and opening a shop in half a year or so and I'd like to have our energies properly focused.
Thank you,
Paul Nagel The Bicycle Tree P.O. Box 11293 Santa Ana, CA 92711 http://www.thebicycletree.org info@thebicycletree.org
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participants (4)
-
Brett Schager -
James McCarthy -
Paul Nagel -
Plan B