Hi All, just a reader who follows you all and totally gets and appreciates what it is you do. I chime in every now and again when I think I can contribute something helpful. This is one of those times....I have been watching this thread as many of you compare or look for language you can use to inform and have folks affix their signatures to (sign) acknowledging what it is you do, what it is they'll be doing and what issues to their well being might exist and that you insist they do not hold you (responsible) liable in any way. This is other wise known as a liability waiver.

First, did you all know by swapping liability waivers you might be held responsible for theft of "work product", or "copy write" infringement depending on where you got the language from to begin with?

Second, I beg you, before you start using a Liability Waiver (LW), please, please and again please, check with not only your state laws, but also you organizations most trusted lawyer (not that this will help you). Different states have different liability laws, and different ways of interpreting seemingly similar laws. Using a LW created in Texas in California would be a very huge mistake in most instances.

Third, Realize that by using a LW you are opening a can of worms. Yes, I know you open one as well by not using one, but trust me, this is a matter of choosing between the worst of two evils in many if not all instances.

In many instances a LW is looked at as giving "prior notice" and let say you should have a clause in your LW that says you are not responsible in the event of property loss due to fire. And lets say you just moved into a brand new facility, and what do you know a fire breaks out...(not pointing fingers here).

A court might hold that you had reasonable knowledge that fire was an issue, and you EVEN gave prior notice in your LW, so guess what? The court might hold that you knew the threat of fire was a reasonable concern, and you had a responsibility to act in a prudent manner to prevent it, which you clearly did not, as you openly have stated solvent soaked rags were left improperly attended to. So LW or not you are going to be held responsible.

More to the case at hand (whatever it might be) you demonstrated awareness of this by giving prior notice in the form of a LW and still failed to act prudently and therefore the complainant is awarded what it seeks, and possibly more if you get the wrong judge. Don't laugh...I've seen it happen.

So, bottom line, think carefully, long and hard about using a liability waiver. (B) Check local law and authority and your own legal advisers before putting one into use...language is hugely important. (C) Realize that a general LW is about as useful as a day old newspaper, so specific language is a very good idea. (D) the more specific the language the higher the degree or responsibility might be accorded to you or your organization in the event of a legal action. (E) The best way to avoid legal actions are to stay within the letter of the law, build a stellar reputation, and create fulfilling and satisfactory relationships with those that come into your shop. (F) There is no full proof way to escape the probability that sooner or later you will likely be involved in a legal matter and action.

Sorry to be the rain on anyone's parade.

Best of luck,

Matt Fenichel

-----Original Message----- From: Dave Baker bikebaker@yahoo.com To: The Think Tank thethinktank@lists.bikecollectives.org Sent: Fri, Aug 16, 2013 9:02 am Subject: Re: [TheThinkTank] Liability Waiver Samples

Hey Rich, This is the one we use for The Bike Works down here in Silver City, New Mexico. We have some friends up in Boulder we are long overdue to visit, so if I make it up there I would love to stop by and see your digs. thanks, Dave Baker

From: director director@communitycycles.org To: The Think Tank thethinktank@lists.bikecollectives.org Sent: Monday, August 12, 2013 4:41 PM Subject: [TheThinkTank] Liability Waiver Samples

Hey All, We're going to start using a liability waiver. I'm looking for examples to model ours after. Please send yours to the list and/or post on the wiki.

Thanks!