- TheThinkTank - lists.bikecollectives.org

Re: [TheThinkTank] Parts washers/gmail
by Tom Emm 11 Feb '08

11 Feb '08

Pat, scroll down a little and click on link that say parts washers, after "Kelly bluebook" also, a few letters in the gmail should be looked at. Tom Send Thethinktank mailing list submissions to thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to thethinktank-request(a)bikecollectives.org You can reach the person managing the list at thethinktank-owner(a)bikecollectives.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Thethinktank digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: bio cleaner, and bike blue book.... (Jonathan Morrison) 2. Valet Bike Parking (Jonathan Morrison) 3. Re: Valet Bike Parking (ronald ferrucci) 4. Re: Valet Bike Parking (keri conrad) 5. Re: Valet Bike Parking (Urban Bike Project of Wilmington, Inc.) 6. Re: Valet Bike Parking (Chris Carlsson) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2008 10:30:46 -0700 From: "Jonathan Morrison" Subject: Re: [TheThinkTank] bio cleaner, and bike blue book.... To: "The Think Tank" Message-ID: <4dd29fd10802100930v77acfcc3t858adfcb5718e8df(a)mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" 1) The Kelley Blue Book for cars is also affected by region too. We have a unique issue because to keep our shop from getting too full we sell the bikes for next to nothing, or give them away to people who have a letter from a good will agency, just so they don't start stacking up. Working Bikes in Chicago is a great example of an organization who makes their margins in quantity. 2) http://www.bikecollectives.org/wiki/index.php?title=Parts_Washers -- Sincerely, Jonathan Morrison Executive Director Salt Lake City Bicycle Collective 2312 S. West Temple Salt Lake City, UT 84115 w: 801-328-2453 c: 801-688-0183 f: 801-466-3856 www.slcbikecollective.org Get Addicted to Crank! http://www.slcbikecollective.org/crank/ On Feb 10, 2008 12:17 AM, Angelo Coletta wrote: > While there is no comprehensive pricing book for cycles, there are ones > that have been done for those who collect "classic American bikes(1930 to > 1960)" > > I have used a halfing method for appraisal. $200 was the new selling > price; 1yr old $100; 2yr $50.00 and so forth. That is a base line. Then > comes the art and the subjective: condition, desirability, rarity. Any > up-fitting done? Frame type and size. Component quality. Accessories. > All factors that affect value. Also there is the wholesale price and the > retail price. That would reflect any labor invested in making the unit > saleable. > > Hope this helps. > > Angelo > > *Velocipede Bike Project * wrote: > > So here are two hare brain ideas that have been thrown out here in > baltimore and i wanted to get y'alls take on them... > > 1. a bicycle blue book...we were talking about pricing bikes and how > arbitrary it often seems,(often two members will claim wildly different > prices with equal authority and citing the same number of sources) and > someone mentioned that in this time of the growing bicycle > collective/community shop projects there may be enough of a market to be > able to approach a publisher about creating a blue book that would price > for instance, a 1982 murray...I know this sounds crazy, but I was > wondering how crazy was it really.... > > 2. Someone approached us recently about a bio friendly parts cleaner. > Apparently it has enzymes that eat oil so less bad stuff going into the > environment/less exposure to toxic chemicals ourselves. He said he may be > able to get us a machine for free, but it would cost around a grand to > fill it up. does anyone have any experience with this kind of machine or > technology? Is it worth our time and fundraising? I've been thinking alot > lately about ways to make our shop more green friendly by doing things > like cutting down on plastic use and using vinegar and baking soda as > cleaners instead of bleach and such... > > http://www.biocircle.com/portal/page?_pageid=73,394253&_dad=portal&_schema=… > > what do y'all think? am I crazy? > -beth > velocipede bike project > baltmore, md(hey, try to remember to include your city and shop in posts) > > > _______________________________________________ > Thethinktank mailing list > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org > > http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… > > > > _______________________________________________ > Thethinktank mailing list > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org > > http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… > >

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Sheldon Brown passed away...
by Jonathan Morrison 09 Feb '08

09 Feb '08

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/index.html -- Sincerely, Jonathan Morrison Executive Director Salt Lake City Bicycle Collective 2312 S. West Temple Salt Lake City, UT 84115 w: 801-328-2453 c: 801-688-0183 f: 801-466-3856 www.slcbikecollective.org Get Addicted to Crank! http://www.slcbikecollective.org/crank/

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Volunteering time
by BovineOaks＠aol.com 09 Feb '08

09 Feb '08

Being white gives us privileges that might make it easier to 'donate' a lot of time to a project you love. Nice racist statement. Other communities donate time to things they cherish. All races and earning levels donate time to the religious practice of their choice. That is universal. Bikes, sadly, are not cherished universally by all communities. Owning a house is focused more in some communities and the car is just a tool to get to work. Owning a fancier car has a greater focus in some communities and owning property is less of a focus. Of course this is a generalization and there are always exceptions. In either rich or poor a community where there is more focus on the car as a status symbol; the bike is less likely to be Cherished. How many Yuppies or true upper crust volunteers do you have? Any Trumps?, Hiltons?, Pritzkers? They all have the money to stop working and volunteer at your bike program. But sadly they do not cherish the bicycle. So for a communities that do not cherish the bicycle, you need to invite the local community members into you bike shop if you want diversity. The bike program should offer adult training and have OBIOUS ways for the adults to volunteer to work on bikes, teach youth, sell bikes, teach other adults, work on inventory, work on web sites, spread the message to the community, help with business contacts, help with volunteers and what ever you need to be successful. I have had special classes for women taught by women that liked my classes. Not all women want the first classes to be with men. They what to do it "on there own" and want to have a like minded teacher, not a person who does a project for them. They want self sufficiency and to feel supported. We need to support the needs of a diverse community, if we want them to come and be part of our shops. If they do not love the bike now, you will have to teach them LOVE OF DA BIKE! and give them oppertunity. Christopher Wallace Chicago **************Biggest Grammy Award surprises of all time on AOL Music. (http://music.aol.com/grammys/pictures/never-won-a-grammy?NCID=aolcmp0030000… 48)

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Key woes and solutions!
by Jonathan Morrison 08 Feb '08

08 Feb '08

I don't know if your organization has issues with volunteers, "lost" or M.I.A. keys, or just not knowing who left the shop a mess after hours. We did, but after looking into all the options ( http://www.bikecollectives.org/wiki/index.php?title=Keyless_Entry) we were able to get a smart card (RFID) reader donated for our shop door. This has worked out really well so far. * A log is kept of who uses the shop and when for accountabilities sake. * Smart cards (http://www.hidcorp.com/technology.php?tech_cat=1&subcat_id=9) can be purchased at any locksmith for the same cost of getting a traditional key cut, but they don't work until they are "registered" with software that controls the door. * Smart cards cannot be copied. * If a card is lost or there is a problem with a volunteer that can't be resolved in a civil manner -- the card can be denied future access. Luckily we haven't had that anything besides "lost" keys. * Access to the shop can be limited to the hour, so if we wanted to we could incubate a volunteer by only giving them access to the shop at certain times. * A magnetic contact on the door gives us a count of roughly how many people use our shop. We realize that some people hold the door for others and some go in and out more than once -- while those might cancel each other out, it is a rough estimate. * We installed the smart card reader at "butt" level. So if it is in your wallet you can open the door without taking your hands off a bike with the "butt swipe." * No personal information is stored on the smart (RFID) card, there is just a pre-programmed number that has to be an inch away for a card reader to detect. -- Sincerely, Jonathan Morrison Executive Director Salt Lake City Bicycle Collective 2312 S. West Temple Salt Lake City, UT 84115 w: 801-328-2453 c: 801-688-0183 f: 801-466-3856 www.slcbikecollective.org Get Addicted to Crank! http://www.slcbikecollective.org/crank/

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Re: [TheThinkTank] Volunteering time
by Jessica McPherson 07 Feb '08

07 Feb '08

Also, can I point out that there is a big difference between characterizing a statement or action as racist, and calling a person a racist? I think it's really important to be able to talk frankly about racism, and that is hard when bringing up the word at all is automatically interpreted as calling people racists. We all do or say racist things sometimes. It doesn't mean we're evil, horrible people. It means there's a situation when people could benefit from honest discussion and an opportunity to learn from others' perspectives. So can we try to be open to that without being offensive/taking offense? And make an extra effort to be clear when this loaded word does get put out there? Race, gender, and class all definitely fit into this issue of accessibility, so it's great we're talking about it those terms. And it's complicated; we can probably all learn something from other peoples' experience. -Jessica ----- Original Message ---- From: Erik Ryberg <ryberg(a)seanet.com> To: The Think Tank <thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org> Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2008 2:29:22 PM Subject: Re: [TheThinkTank] Volunteering time When I went to college I was a poor white kid from rural Oregon on a scholarship to a fancy East Coast private university. Everybody I met there had more money than I did. During the summers they all went off to unpaid internships in NY or LA. I had similar offers, but there was just no way I could afford to do that, move to NYC for three months with no pay. When my friends graduated they got jobs at these places and I ended up working at a bakery. That's what Kyle was talking about. And as an aside he made the leap, perhaps disputed by some here, that people who are not white are more often among those who don't have a lot of money. Maybe you don't agree, but all he was saying is that if you pay people, then you will be more likely to find class and probably race diversity on your staffs. True? False? Maybe? I don't know, but it makes logical sense, and it seems possible to agree with him or disagree with him without being a racist. Erik Ryberg ien wrote: > I see Kyle's point as tunnel vision. Look at other areas reliant on > volunteers and you will see many females, in some cases overwhelmingly. > Case in point: the local chapter of the Big Brothers/Big Sisters > organization reported their volunteers by gender composition is 75% > female, 25% male. That should shoot the theory of white boys being > privileged and in positions to volunteer. It is the bike business in > general that attracts males to the sport. Don't believe me then take a > look at the staff at any bike shop for your random sample. Females are a > breath of fresh air to the sport of cycling and bike riding in general. > But look also to the junior ranks of any state cycling organization and > you will find many more males than females. Credit to those that > volunteer and here is wishing more would join us, especially females. > bikedad > > */Andy Dyson <andy(a)neighborhoodbikeworks.org>/* wrote: > > BovineOaks(a)aol.com wrote: > > Being white gives us privileges that might make it easier to > 'donate' a > > lot of time to a project you love. Nice racist statement. > > > > Some great points in your post, Christopher, but it's the first line I > have a problem with. I think that if you're going to call someone a > racist you should do so in a more direct and clear way, for all of our > benefit. > > Perhaps I'm just not smart, but sarcasm like the above leaves me > wondering exactly what about Kyle's post you thought was racist and > why. > There are various interpretations I could think of, but why people in > our community are calling each other racists is not an area where I > want > to jump to any conclusions. I do actually want to know what you think, > because I don't think that Kyle was denying that people of all > backgrounds volunteer, rather that privilege exists and it makes things > easier for young, white males. > > I think that the whole point of Kyle's post is to draw attention to the > existence of privilege, something that, in my experience, is not > obvious > to all of us. > > Peace, > > Andy > > -- > Andrew C. Dyson > Executive Director Neighborhood Bike Works > Increasing opportunities for youth through bicycling > > > Check our Web Site: > http://www.neighborhoodbikeworks.org > > > Neighborhood Bike Works > 3916 Locust Walk, > Philadelphia, PA 19104 > > > Office: (215) 386-0316 > Cell: (215) 873-6695 > FAX: (215) 386-7288 > _______________________________________________ > Thethinktank mailing list > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org > http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… > > > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51438/*http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs> > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Thethinktank mailing list > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org > http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… -- Erik B. Ryberg Attorney at Law 445 West Simpson Street Tucson, AZ 85701 (520) 622-3333 _______________________________________________ Thethinktank mailing list Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping

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Cheap Helmets!
by AndaLaLucha 05 Feb '08

05 Feb '08

Hello Think Tankers, I was wondering where people get their kids bike helmets from. Has anyone had sucess getting some donated? Are their websites/companies people can recommend. So far we have found www.prorider.com $3 for basic kinda crappy helmets www.*helmets*rus.net/*nonprofit*/ $5 and $6 for nicer helmet with modern adjusting features that are much safer Any other ideas? Andalusia P.S R.I.P. Sheldon Brown : ( PPS If i get a chance I may also try later to explain how free ride's volunteer/comission/contracting staff system works.

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Re: [TheThinkTank] [SLC Bike Collective] Sheldon Brown passed away...
by Bacus, Tom (KLC) 05 Feb '08

05 Feb '08

Sad news indeed. I never met him, but he helped me set up my first single speed via phone calls and email. The bike community has lost one of the great ones. -------------------------- Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld ----- Original Message ----- From: community-bounces(a)slcbikecollective.org <community-bounces(a)slcbikecollective.org> To: The Think Tank <thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org>; SLC Bicycle Collective <community(a)slcbikecollective.org>; SLC Critical Mass <community(a)slccriticalmass.org> Sent: Mon Feb 04 13:17:03 2008 Subject: [SLC Bike Collective] Sheldon Brown passed away... http://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/index.html -- Sincerely, Jonathan Morrison Executive Director Salt Lake City Bicycle Collective 2312 S. West Temple Salt Lake City, UT 84115 w: 801-328-2453 c: 801-688-0183 f: 801-466-3856 www.slcbikecollective.org Get Addicted to Crank! http://www.slcbikecollective.org/crank/

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alternative payment/stipend structures
by Erik Stockmeier 04 Feb '08

04 Feb '08

Hello, comrades, At BB last year I heard a number of different takes on the issue of payment to core/committed/etc members of the shop. This is obviously something that many of us have struggled with--a small stipend can enable someone to spend much more time in the shop and increase productivity, etc, but it also can have pitfalls: shifting emphasis toward making money & away from service/community/etc goals. Not to be nosey, but I'm wondering how different shops have approached this, both through payrolls and alternate routes. I'm also wondering what kind of decision-making and account-taking goes on in regards to taking care of each others' needs so that neither individuals nor the organisation as an organism is exploited. There are also questions of seasonable labor, the threat of a paid, empowered elite vs the volunteer masses... I'm just thinking out loud. Sorry this question is so broad and filled with etc's. If any kind of discussion comes out of it I will be happy to elaborate on my own experiences (can't speak for all of The Recyclery) but for now I'm curious about what else is out there and how well it has worked. I'm interested to hear from all-volunteer groups as well, of course. Thanks- Erik Stockmeier The Recyclery www.therecyclery.org

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Re: [TheThinkTank] Collective members/ordering from QBP
by Jessica McPherson 04 Feb '08

04 Feb '08

Something to add is that we require people to give 24 hours volunteer time every three months in order to join the collective council. The qbp privilege is a bonus for that commitment. And, it is consistent with QBP's policy, in that the people who can make personal orders are essentially the "employees" of the shop. -Jessica ----- Original Message ---- From: Stuart O Anderson <soa(a)ri.cmu.edu> To: The Think Tank <thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org> Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 4:17:43 PM Subject: Re: [TheThinkTank] Collective members/ordering from QBP I can't find the policy on the QBP dealer site, you might want to call your account rep to check. I believe the deal is that it's OK for shop employees to make personal orders for personal use, possibly with some total dollar cap on how much can be ordered for this use in a year? We let collective members add items to our orders for personal use with the understanding that the stuff they order isn't going to be given away/resold. If someone wants more than $500 worth of stuff it goes through collective review. Stuart On Jan 30, 2008 2:14 PM, <plan_9(a)riseup.net> wrote: > I was wondering if anyone has any policy in place that allows or > dis-allows collective members from ordering new parts, frame/forks, or > even complete bikes from QBP. Shops that do allow ordering, what > restrictions from QBP apply? > Thanks, Andrew > FMCBW > > > _______________________________________________ > Thethinktank mailing list > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org > http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… > > _______________________________________________ Thethinktank mailing list Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… ____________________________________________________________________________________ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ

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Forums for Website
by Sarah 04 Feb '08

04 Feb '08

Hey, y'all! Anyone have an amazing free forum program you run on your website? Or, what have folks used on BikeBike websites in the past? Are there free forums you suggest, or some you don't like at all? Any input is greatly appreciated! Thanks, ~ Sarahtops thebestsarah(a)gmail.com Madison, Wisconsin FreeWheel Community Bike Shop - www.freewheelbikes.org Neverwood Collective - www.pnc2rnc.org

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