- TheThinkTank - lists.bikecollectives.org

Liability insurance/ Children's legal issues?
by Sandy Robson 28 Apr '08

28 Apr '08

Howdy from St. Paul, Minnesota! We've been having a pretty successful starting season at Sibley Bike Depot--maintenance classes, a women's/trans open shop night, an after school program, art bike projects...it's all going swell. Right now we have a number of children that come to our open-shop hours and earn bikes. We don't have any liability insurance whatsoever, so we've temporarily limited the number of kids allowed in the shop at one time. How do you all handle this? Do you have any advice as to what kind of insurance/ forms we need? Thanks! Sandy Robson (410)206-7826

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Mayor's Ride May 12!
by Community Bicycle Shop Omaha 25 Apr '08

25 Apr '08

2008 Mayor's Ride to Start at the Community Bicycle Shop! Start your day off right on *Monday, May 12 at 8:00* am and bring your bicycle down to 33rd and California! Community Bicycle Shop Omaha (CBSO) is pleased to partner with Mayor Mike Fahey, Activate Omaha, and Bikeable Communities to bring the Mayor's Ride to Gifford Park. This event kicks off National Bike to Work Week and will include the presentation of Omaha's first commuter bicycle map. The mayor will make a proclamation at 8:30 am and the group will ride to the Pedestrian Bridge downtown and back through Creighton's campus. Bicycling to work is good exercise and saves money on gas. Cycling instead of driving is also good for air quality and mitigates global warming. Most important to CBSO is the immediate benefit of your presence on the street! Our streets are safer and more enjoyable when we employ human power to get us where we're going. If you are new to bicycle commuting this is a great way to get started! All you need is a bicycle and helmet. The ride will be guided by the police so that traffic at intersections will be monitored. If you'd like to know more about the event call Stuart at 216-1235 or visit * www.activateomaha.org*.

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Cheap locks/stolen bikes
by plan_9＠riseup.net 25 Apr '08

25 Apr '08

We at the FM Community Bicycle Workshop have had a good,(read: busy, chaotic, overwhelming) first spring openand have run into a few unexpected situations regarding stolen bikes. We have a one bike a year limit policy and have had individuals get bikes from us, then come back the next week saying theirs was stolen and they want to get another one. Some of these were pretty decent, modern bikes (trek 4300, Giant Cyprus, Diamondback BMX) and we don't want to suspect the worst, that these bikes were pawned or sold for profit rather than ridden, but we also don't want to open ourselves up to exploitation either. We have put in place a policy that if you bring us a copy of your police report you are eligible for earning another bike, assuming that folks wouldn't file a false police report. We don't live in an area that has high bike theft rates, except for "bike hopping" where people just grab a bike that isn't being used and leave it wherever they end up. Basically, crime of opportunity rather than intent. The bigger issue here is that we are getting folks bikes who can't normally afford one, but not giving them the means to secure it. We are interested in getting locks to give out to people who get bikes from us through our referral system but are debating which is the best solution. One idea would be to buy cheap cable locks in bulk. Another idea we have had is a much more DIY approach: Get a roll of beefy hardware store chain and a padlock and call it good. Has anyone run into this? Thoughts? -Andy FMCBW

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New shop name ideas, anyone?
by Jennifer Nordhem 25 Apr '08

25 Apr '08

We've decided against using the name Battlesteed for multiple reasons. Does anyone have a good name the didn't get picked for their shop that they still like or came up with after it was set in stone. This is really the only thing that's holding us back right now since we can't file as a non-profit organization until we have one. This is our brief mission: We are a small group of avid cyclists who, through our love for the bike, decided to found Battlesteed Custom Bike Works. Battlesteed's mission is to create a larger, more knowledgeable and self-reliant community in Denver through teaching affordable bicycle mechanics classes in a comfortable, unpretentious learning environment. These are other intentions of the shop: -To hold monthly art shows to support the growing art community of Denver and advertise our services to new potential students. -To sublet space/benches to people (mainly people who are teaching classes and are involved with the shop) for their personal tools... we even have a friend interested in using his space for a screen printing press which he will teach classes in as well. Any ideas?! Thanks, Jen Nordhem Denver

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Following up with Bike Donors
by Rich Points 24 Apr '08

24 Apr '08

Collectives, At Community Cycles when someone donates a bike we have them fill out a tax deductible donation receipt. This is a carbon copy form where the donor gets one copy and we get the other. We then take that info an input into our database. We've done this for about 9 months now and have quite a few Bike_Donor contacts. So far we haven't contacted these donors but I've been thinking of doing a direct mail campaign to these people. My question is, have other collectives done this kind of direct mail? Or more broadly how are you following up with people who donate bikes and parts to you? Peace -- Rich Points Community Cycles Director http://CommunityCycles.org Rich(a)CommunityCycles.org 720-565-6019

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Re: [TheThinkTank] illustrated instruction booklet
by dragonfly＠mac.hush.com 17 Apr '08

17 Apr '08

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hello, Everyone Back in the 1980's when I was a little kid, my big sister was part of a group called Cycle Watch, which was one of the early local cyclists groups in Toronto. Cycle Watch made a beautiful little booklet for cyclists. It had a yellow cover of a light card stock and accordion folded paper inside. It was small enough to fit inside a wallet, but it was a little fat. Sort of the thickness of a package of rolling papers (I'm getting all Canadian on you now.) Instead of information about flats, it had a picture of a bike with all the parts labelled with their names, and spaces for you to write in information about your bike, such as the make, the size, the serial number, the City bike licence if you had one, etc. The next little pages were a description of what information you needed to gather if you were in an accident-- the name and details of the driver who hit you (Kate had to explain the concept of insurance to me), and space for contact info. for witnesses, plus the name and badge number of the police officers, etc.. (They used small type.) It was a little booklet of information about how to record all the things that would help you win a traffic case if you were hit (the picture ofthe bike with the names of the parts was to help you describe your bike or the damage to it), plus all the info you'd need to have if your bike was stolen. It was great. Part of what made it compelling to me was that it was kid- sized. My sister gave me a whole bunch of these booklets to hand out at school (As my mother had encouraged me to afix a "Midwives do it Better" button to my knapsack, you can imagine how cool the cool kids found me, right?); to my amazement, everyone wanted them. I've often thought of recreating them, and I've wondered if they would still be popluar-- if you are working on a little booklet, something like that might go over well. A bi-lingual version would be a good design problem-- how to include all the info while preserving readability and a small size. For me, those little yellow booklets were my introduction to cycling as something that created a community, and also an early, simple way of participating in do-it-yourself politics. Thanks for reminding me of something happy, and good luck with your project. Sasha On Thu, 17 Apr 2008 14:09:23 -0400 "Urban Bike Project Wilmington, DE" <urbanbikeproject(a)gmail.com> wrote: >http://www.bikecollectives.org/wiki/index.php?title=Spanish_Resourc >e_Materials > >The first link is a good place to start, maybe you could print it >front/back >and fold it. > >Brian > >On Thu, Apr 17, 2008 at 2:02 PM, Sharlyn Grace ><sharlyngrace(a)gmail.com> >wrote: > >> Hello all, >> >> We're thinking of putting together an illustrated little booklet >> (bi-lingual) that people could carry around as a resource-- >mostly right now >> we're thinking how to fix flats, tips like putting a dollar >inside a tire >> with a hole, etc. Does anyone know if something like this >exists? Or do >> you have good ideas about what would be useful information to >include? We >> want it to be really small, but also helpful. We have so many >people come >> in and fix a flat and never think about it again, so they're >helpless when >> the next one comes around, so this is an attempt to make the >info >> non-technical and available all the time. >> >> Thanks!, >> Sharlyn >> >> The Recyclery >> Evanston, IL >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Thethinktank mailing list >> Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org >> >> http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank- >bikecollectives.org >> >> > > >-- >Urban Bike Project of Wilmington >1908 N. Market Street (entrance is in the parking lot behind the >building) >Wilmington, DE 19801 > >Hours: >Thursday 6:30-9:00 >Saturday 1:00-4:00 > >Visit us online at http://urbanbikeproject.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Note: This signature can be verified at https://www.hushtools.com/verify Charset: UTF8 Version: Hush 3.0 wkYEARECAAYFAkgHo/EACgkQ5O7ahKJmrRlBcwCgspKA561xLxabj6eHRCyfKkM+CbsA oIBvdZ3xIIfVsQAw0uijdsSRII/R =EeZ3 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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illustrated instruction booklet
by Sharlyn Grace 17 Apr '08

17 Apr '08

Hello all, We're thinking of putting together an illustrated little booklet (bi-lingual) that people could carry around as a resource--mostly right now we're thinking how to fix flats, tips like putting a dollar inside a tire with a hole, etc. Does anyone know if something like this exists? Or do you have good ideas about what would be useful information to include? We want it to be really small, but also helpful. We have so many people come in and fix a flat and never think about it again, so they're helpless when the next one comes around, so this is an attempt to make the info non-technical and available all the time. Thanks!, Sharlyn The Recyclery Evanston, IL

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Being seen at night: Lighting and reflective materials
by BovineOaks＠aol.com 16 Apr '08

16 Apr '08

I wrote this for another bike group, I thought you might find some of the information useful. I have been a light tester for year. 25 years as a photographer with a tra ined eye to respond to changes in light and study lighting contrast. Constantly studying ever changing lighting conditions has helped me see bike lighting effectiveness in relationship to other traffic. I do not believe anything workes to make me seen by cars, I test it to prove it works all of the time, some of the time or is just Psychological protection. I have also studied how the eye reacts to different levels of light. I have carefully evaluated the eyes reaction time to change when eyes are blinded by bright car head lamps, to how long it takes to see much lower intensity LED blinky lights. I have studied how the spacing of lights creates the illusion of space or can hide the true shape and size of an object. Trying to keep things short I have found the following the be most effective. 6 and 12 volt bright helmet lamps 6 volt generator, 6 and 12 volt rechargeable battery lamps mounted to the bars or above the front wheel. Blinky's out on the ends of the bars and lower on the fork. Multiple red led strobes spread out across the rider and the rear of a bike or trailer. Reflective side walls on tires. Rear facing reflective material on bike, rider, bag, trailer, Reflective material on Left wrist for arm signals. Front facing reflective material If you want to read the reasoning continue on, if not, stop here. I have been trained to act like traffic. I do not know any electric or petroleum powered traffic that uses low watt LED blinky lights as the primary source of light to be noticed by other traffic. If low watt LED's were a sufficient light source, all car manufactures would use them to cut costs. I am traffic, I need to have similarly powerfully lights to be seen effectively by other traffic on the road. Cars do hit other cars with bright lights, having bright lights on a bike will not stop impacts, It will increase visibility of cyclist and reduce incidents. I wish it could end incidents between vehicles, that is a human behavior issue. Reflective material In your lane of traffic you should see red 10 watt light ahead of you and white 50 watt lights behind you. Reflective material works best when there is very little light behind it. Reflective material reflects less light than it receives. As a rider you are for the most part directly in front of the motor vehicles 50 watt head lamps. Your material will reflect 30% to 70% of this light, which is much more light than the 10 watt red lamps ahead of the rider. This makes rear facing reflective material greatly effective at all times. Front facing reflective materials are very effective when you are alone on the road ways. You are not positioned directly ahead of oncoming car headlamps, you are off to their side and out of the strongest part of their headlight beam. On coming traffic can easily distinguish you from the darker background. When you ride on the right side of the road you are not straight in front of oncoming head lamps where the light is focused and the brightest, you are on the far side or the edge of their lamps beam. You may only receive 10 watt of the 50 watts of light coming from their lamps and you are reflecting even less of that light. To reduce the effectiveness of reflective material even more the traffic behind you is backlighting you with 50 watt lamps this makes the few watts of light coming from the vest almost invisible. All of this is bull unless you can test it. I have tested it and you can too. Have a friend put all your reflective stuff on. Get a bright hand held spot light or a car, aiming the light down the side of the road the cyclist is not on. Have the cyclist stand still at 100 yards away 50 yards away and 25 yards away. Look at how bright the reflective material is when the cyclist has a car behind and beside them, and when there is no car around them. Have the friend switch to the same side of the road you are on with their back facing you. Look at how much more light comes off the reflective material from your hand held spot light or from your car. Watch how the reflective light changes as a car in your same lane approaches the cyclist and after they pass the cyclist and the tail lights are on the other side of them. You can also evaluate how much the reflective light changes as oncoming cars in the opposite lane pass by the cyclist. I have done this test and I was surprised and horrified by the results. I thought reflective materials worked all the time and were great. Now I know they are a part of a complete package to be seen by other traffic. I agree with Jim and others "It's always a good idea to have lots of reflectors. You can never have too many." I have reflectors or reflective tape on my trailers, bike, clothing, helmet, tires, if I could get reflective teeth I would. I love having a reflective strip, cuff, glove on my left arm for night time turn signals. I sometimes put a reflective ankle strap around my wrist for signaling. Rear lights I had a few experiences that taught me about how we perceive the size of an object by the spacing of lights. Cars with one head lamp look like a motorcycle. Trucks on dark roads out in the country appear to be farther away if the tail lights are inside the rear step instead of on the outside corners of the trailer. I was in a blinding snow storm at night looking ahead for tail lights. When I saw the lights I thought I was 150 feet away from the truck. I switched lanes only to fine I was right next to the truck instead of 150 feet away. The two tail lights were between the stair instead of on the out side corners of the trailer that threw my perception of distance off. Same thing with bike lights. A single light from a bike has to go through a windshield of a car before it reaches the driver. If you look at a red blinky that is far away you will find that the normal road dust and fine scratches on the windshield change the appearance of the lights. Red lamps farther away will look larger, and light closer will look smaller. This is the reverse of what it should be. Two blinky light separated give traffic more consistent way to judge the distance they are from you. I like a blinky on the cyclist back and one on the bike. Examples: One on the helmet or back pack or courier bag or collar of clothing. The other mounted on the seat post, rack, handlebar ends, high on a trailer. The idea is to have one light low and one high to give you shape. The more lights the easier it is to show your shape to other traffic and help other traffic judge distance and closing speed. Blinky and reflective material work great on the back of your bike. Reflective tires Something I was surprised by: Reflective sidewalls on tires. My thoughts were what help are reflective sidewalls? If the side of a bike is in front of a car it is a little late. All I can say is that I was wrong. I found that the sidewalls did reflect from the front and rear. As we keep balance we turn the tire a little to the left and right all the time. This turning back and forth allows the reflective surfaces to gather and shoot back light like a blinky. The tires strobe and catch attention in a large way. I recommend Reflective Tires whole heartily now. Up to now I have not talked about expensive lights. Blinkys, reflectors, reflective tires are not super expensive to do well. I am traffic and need to act like the rest of traffic to be seen in ALL conditions. Bright Head Lamps I am surrounded by traffic with 50 Watt head beams. I am surrounded by people whose iris closes down when they are facing bright head lamps. This smaller hole in the eye lets less light in and makes it harder to see dimmer low wattage lights. In simple language if you have a car behind you or one has just passed you, it is likely that any oncoming traffic will not be able to see a low watt blinky or flashlight because there iris takes a while to recover and become large enough to see dimmer lights. This is why it is important to have a similar amount of light coming off your bike as is coming of the rest of traffic. Some newer LED lights put out the same amount of light as a 30 watt incandescent bulb. I have seen them priced at $50 to $70. If you know your history then you know that lights this bright were triple that amount of money three years ago. I have one light system that cost $360 and a helmet light that was $180. Modern lights are much more affordable. I like a 30 watt light on the bike and one on the head. One to light the ground effectively and one to look over at traffic coming in from the side. I like to make sure I am seen, get the attention of a driver and see their face. I like a mindful driver and I make sure I am not invisible to them.When I can see their face I know they can see my light. On the road at night I am SOL the sun god, not black invisible Ninja. I act like traffic because I am traffic. Christopher Wallace **************Need a new ride? Check out the largest site for U.S. used car listings at AOL Autos. (http://autos.aol.com/used?NCID=aolcmp00300000002851)

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Re: [TheThinkTank] Cheap locks/stolen bikes
by dragonfly＠mac.hush.com 16 Apr '08

16 Apr '08

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hello, Everyone Sometimes people in Detroit try to earn one or more bikes to help get bikes for other family members or friends without the time to do EAB themselves. (Not all older siblings are evil bike thieves.) Single mums sometimes need help earning bikes for themselves and a couple of kids, some of whom are too small to be responsible for EAB hours. Kids sometimes earn bikes for their mums as a present after earning their own. People who live far away or who do shift work or who work a million little jobs to keep afloat sometimes have a friend who will earn a bike for them. The locks made of chain from the hardware store (often covered with bits old fire hose to make it harder to cut) and a padlock are popular and apparently effective here. Coming from Toronto, where bike theft is a real problem, I was amazed to see Detroiters leaving their bikes on the ground outside-- unlocked!-- to go into stores. Many of the thefts we have involve people trustingly leaving their bikes completely unlocked. If I hadn't seen it with my own eyes, I would never have believed the tales of the naive, trusting denizens of Detroit's Cass Corridor... Sasha On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 15:56:14 -0400 veganboyjosh(a)gmail.com wrote: >We got the city of Boulder to subsidize locks, lights, racks, and >a small >tool/set for each of our Youth EAB students. The locks are the 4 >tumbler >number kind that you can "program" with your own combination, so >the kids >won't forget. One issue we had early on was someone opened her >lock to lock >up her bike, and bumped one of the tumblers, and couldn't get it >to lock. >she didn't know what to do, so she left it unlocked. Then it got >taken. (We >now walk the kids through the process of locking and unlocking and >locking >again their locks. It's almost as important to me to explain that >the locks >won'tclose if the combination is wrong, just as it won't open... > >Anyway, we've also encountered the older sibling/evil evil bike >thief >takes/breaks an EAB'ers bike...we're still working on a solution. > >My thought is that anyone should be able to earn as many bikes as >they want, >with one caveat. With each bike that they earn, the hours they >need to put >in go up. For example, in the normal program, students go through >12-16 >hours of work before they earn a (first) bike of their own. With >my >proposal, if someone wants to come in and earn a second bike, it >would take >20-24 hours, or some appropriate amount. The goal would be for >them to have >the option to do it, but make it silly enough (wanna earn 5 bikes? >work 200 >hours...etc) that it's not worth it. I realize there are some >other >issues--what if someone comes in and wants to earn 5 bikes, no >matter how >many hours it takes?--but i don't like the idea of limiting people >to one >bike... >This way, while students have more invested in the second, third, >etc, bikes >they've earned, which hopefully encourages them to take better >care of their >bike/security, it also offers them the opportunity to get another >bike >should the first one get stolen, run over by mom/dad, etc. > > > > >On Wed, Apr 16, 2008 at 1:37 PM, rachael spiewak ><rachael(a)sopobikes.org> >wrote: > >> We've been running into this with the younger folks at the bike >shop, and >> we have to be firm about our earn one bike and one bike only >policy. >> They're allowed to trade in their bike for a different one only >if the one >> they're turning in is in good condition, and we regularly have >chats about >> why our policy is what it is. We also chat about how not to get >your bike >> stolen. It's hard when older siblings are the ones taking the >bikes away >> from the kids who come up to the shop and otherwise abide by >what we have to >> offer, so we do our best to be understanding. The most we can >do is create >> a system of accountability that makes sense for us, stick to our >rules for >> the good of the entire shop community, and be understanding >about >> extenuating circumstances. >> >> When we can find deals on locks, we buy a few and distribute >them to folks >> who express the need for one. That seems to work for some >people. The >> younger folks tend to lose keys, so combo locks work best for >them. I try >> to keep a list of their lock combinations and spare keys to help >them out >> when things get lost or forgotten. >> >> If folks don't trade cash for bikes, are they doing anything to >create a >> sense of investment or ownership in the bikes? >> >> -r >> >> >> >> On Wed, Apr 16, 2008 at 3:24 PM, <plan_9(a)riseup.net> wrote: >> >> > We at the FM Community Bicycle Workshop have had a good,(read: >busy, >> > chaotic, overwhelming) first spring openand have run into a >few >> > unexpected situations regarding stolen bikes. We have a one >bike a >> > year limit policy and have had individuals get bikes from us, >then >> > come back the next week saying theirs was stolen and they want >to get >> > another one. Some of these were pretty decent, modern bikes >(trek >> > 4300, Giant Cyprus, Diamondback BMX) and we don't want to >suspect the >> > worst, that these bikes were pawned or sold for profit rather >than >> > ridden, but we also don't want to open ourselves up to >exploitation >> > either. We have put in place a policy that if you bring us a >copy of >> > your police report you are eligible for earning another bike, >assuming >> > that folks wouldn't file a false police report. We don't live >in an >> > area that has high bike theft rates, except for "bike hopping" >where >> > people just grab a bike that isn't being used and leave it >wherever >> > they end up. Basically, crime of opportunity rather than >intent. The >> > bigger issue here is that we are getting folks bikes who can't >> > normally afford one, but not giving them the means to secure >it. We >> > are interested in getting locks to give out to people who get >bikes >> > from us through our referral system but are debating which is >the best >> > solution. One idea would be to buy cheap cable locks in bulk. >Another >> > idea we have had is a much more DIY approach: Get a roll of >beefy >> > hardware store chain and a padlock and call it good. Has >anyone run >> > into this? Thoughts? >> > -Andy FMCBW >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Thethinktank mailing list >> > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org >> > >> > http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank- >bikecollectives.org >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> Sopo Bicycle Cooperative >> 404-425-9989 >> www.sopobikes.org >> * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * >> Hours of operation: >> Tues/Thurs 7 pm - 10 pm >> Sat/Sun 2 pm - 5 pm >> _______________________________________________ >> Thethinktank mailing list >> Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org >> >> http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank- >bikecollectives.org >> >> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Note: This signature can be verified at https://www.hushtools.com/verify Charset: UTF8 Version: Hush 3.0 wkYEARECAAYFAkgGYUwACgkQ5O7ahKJmrRldeACggmrH2IqkO6dLjTP3KUKKrPuA8TsA n0//+iabyCayeMXgvbfshjkFI6jw =PMkr -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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moving bikes by bike
by Bob Giordano 15 Apr '08

15 Apr '08

freewheelin' friends, We are having our annual Festival of Cycles this weekend and we are reviving an old tradition: moving all the bikes to the festival by bike/people power. At the peak, we moved 600 bikes on 3 giant haywagons across town to the festival site, with people pushing and pulling- quite fun. We no longer have access to the hay wagons and we are thinking of using lots of boat trailers hooked to bikes, with people walking and biking along side. We have about 400 bikes to move this way- any ideas or thoughts before we began the search for 10 trailers? thanks, -Bob G., Free Cycles Missoula

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who's got resources en español?
by rachael spiewak 10 Apr '08

10 Apr '08

We just got the news that a community bike shop is in the works in a suburb of Atlanta that's largely populated by Spanish speaking recent arrivals. Thought I'd ask the kind folks on this list for a round up of resources en español to send over to the shop organizers. We've already got the BICAS manual (has some Spanish translations), which is my favorite repair manual in general. Is there a way to filter the Wiki to search only for things in a particular language? Or can there be a section for multilingual resources? Thanks! -rachael -- Sopo Bicycle Cooperative 404-425-9989 www.sopobikes.org * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Hours of operation: Tues/Thurs 7 pm - 10 pm Sat/Sun 2 pm - 5 pm

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BICAS is hiring
by kyle mckinley 10 Apr '08

10 Apr '08

All- Anyone wanna join us for the warmest weather this side of the Sahara? Please tell your friends and coworkers, especially if they are/ might soon be in Tucson. BICAS, a collectively run non-profit BICYCLE recycling and education center is seeking a part time Staff Collective Member, $8.50/hr. Job Description: assist customers, help with classes, build bikes, coordinate volunteers, etc. Personable and comfortable greeting customers, strong mechanical skills encouraged, bilingual a plus, interest or experience in teaching classes or grant writing/organizational work a plus. Diversity of age, gender, and ethnicity encouraged. Accepting resume˙s until April 25th. Contact bicasunderground(a)yahoo.com or 44 W. 6th St (drop in or mail) for resumes, #628-7950 or e-mail for questions. www.bicas.org. thanks,kyle -- If an Easyrider rides easy, then a bicirider rides bicis

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Re: [TheThinkTank] hijacked espanol "thread". or "junk bikes for the world"
by veganboyjosh＠gmail.com 09 Apr '08

09 Apr '08

continuing on the theme of not hijacking the thread; my girlfriend just got back from new orleans, where she went to the book collective and got me the new chainbreaker<http://www.microcosmpublishing.com/catalog/books/2077/>book. it's along these lines, and many people on the list are already familiar with chainbreaker zine. the book is awesome. lots of goodies, and she even put the 4 issues of chainbreaker zine in the back of the book, as the originals were destroyed in hurricane katrina. if you don't have the book, personally, it's an awesome read. good sense of humor, and she's got a list of community bike shops in the back, which is surprisingly up to date, what with it having a 2008 copyright date. well worth the 12 bucks, and an awesome present for someone you like/love. On Wed, Apr 9, 2008 at 9:14 PM, Urban Bike Project Wilmington, DE < urbanbikeproject(a)gmail.com> wrote: > <snip> is there an opportunity to publish a repair manual available to the > general > public? something like "fix any bike or die trying". included would > be such topics as "home-made drop bolts" , "build your dream bike out > of trash on the street" and "my cat could fix this with a hammer, > screwdriver and adjustable wrench (though he should probably use the > proper tools)".</snip>

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Re: [TheThinkTank] parts wanted/available on the wiki?
by dragonfly＠mac.hush.com 09 Apr '08

09 Apr '08

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi, Everyone. A mini-Craig's List for bike shops sounds like a genius idea. Sasha On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 10:33:20 -0400 Jonathan Morrison <jonathan(a)slcbikecollective.org> wrote: >The current job posting on bikecollectives.org is actually an >under utilized >classifieds component, we would just need to add some more >categories. > >On Mon, Mar 31, 2008 at 7:58 PM, <veganboyjosh(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> I know a lot of the traffic we see in Community Cycles is pretty >specific >> to Boulder. We can't keep cruiser type bikes in stock, while >other shops >> can't give them away. >> >> Would it be possible for there to be a place on the wiki or some >other >> spot on the bcn.org site where shops could list things they're >looking >> for, that other shops might be looking to get rid of? Granted, >we're all in >> need of floor pumps and chain tools, but perhaps there's some >class of >> parts of bike types that one shop gets that another shop needs. >It would be >> nice to see that in one place. >> >> I've got a road trip to IKEA in SLC soon, and I'd love to check >out the >> bike shop while I'm there. It occurred to me that the van will >be empty on >> the way there, so I could potentially load it up with stuff they >might need >> that we have excess of...since we're driving anyway. >> >> I don't know that a website feature like this would take much >> maintenance...I'm thinking it could serve three functions; >1>Those >> parts/bikes that your shop is always needing, but cannot keep in >> stock--cruiser bikes for us--, 2>parts and bikes that you have >an excess of, >> and/or wish to pass on...3>specific things you need that another >shop might >> have, instead of going through QPB or the like. We had a bike >come in that >> had a smashed derailleur, and needed a specific hanger, which >QPB didn't >> even sell...granted, this type of thing would be a long shot, >but how many >> of you would rather order a part like that from one another than >from the >> big bike distros a lot of us use? >> >> I guess I'm imagining a sort of mini-craigslist, for bike co-ops >to post >> on. >> >> Thoughts? Feedback? >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Thethinktank mailing list >> Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org >> >> http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank- >bikecollectives.org >> >> > > >-- >Sincerely, > >Jonathan Morrison >Executive Director >Salt Lake City Bicycle Collective >2312 S. West Temple >Salt Lake City, UT 84115 >w: 801-328-2453 >c: 801-688-0183 >f: 801-466-3856 >www.slcbikecollective.org > >Get Addicted to Crank! >http://www.slcbikecollective.org/crank/ > >The mission of the Salt Lake City Bicycle Collective is to promote >cycling >as an effective and sustainable form of transportation and as a >cornerstone >of a cleaner, healthier, and safer society. The Bicycle Collective >provides >refurbished bicycles and educational programs to the community, >focusing on >children and lower income households. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Note: This signature can be verified at https://www.hushtools.com/verify Charset: UTF8 Version: Hush 3.0 wkYEARECAAYFAkf83uMACgkQ5O7ahKJmrRmvSACfSW/wJUyFkU2irOaT/bulrSwddPIA n1xC4/1QUAvZUQGHnGSkU++rl19X =71xf -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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parts wanted/available on the wiki?
by veganboyjosh＠gmail.com 09 Apr '08

09 Apr '08

I know a lot of the traffic we see in Community Cycles is pretty specific to Boulder. We can't keep cruiser type bikes in stock, while other shops can't give them away. Would it be possible for there to be a place on the wiki or some other spot on the bcn.org site where shops could list things they're looking for, that other shops might be looking to get rid of? Granted, we're all in need of floor pumps and chain tools, but perhaps there's some class of parts of bike types that one shop gets that another shop needs. It would be nice to see that in one place. I've got a road trip to IKEA in SLC soon, and I'd love to check out the bike shop while I'm there. It occurred to me that the van will be empty on the way there, so I could potentially load it up with stuff they might need that we have excess of...since we're driving anyway. I don't know that a website feature like this would take much maintenance...I'm thinking it could serve three functions; 1>Those parts/bikes that your shop is always needing, but cannot keep in stock--cruiser bikes for us--, 2>parts and bikes that you have an excess of, and/or wish to pass on...3>specific things you need that another shop might have, instead of going through QPB or the like. We had a bike come in that had a smashed derailleur, and needed a specific hanger, which QPB didn't even sell...granted, this type of thing would be a long shot, but how many of you would rather order a part like that from one another than from the big bike distros a lot of us use? I guess I'm imagining a sort of mini-craigslist, for bike co-ops to post on. Thoughts? Feedback?

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Is your bike coop located in a low income neighborhood?
by Cris Shirley 08 Apr '08

08 Apr '08

Hello, I'm currently writing a research paper on the relationship between bicycle collectives and their low income neighborhood communities. Right now, I am looking for members of collectives which are located in low income neighborhoods, poor parts of towns/cities, or ones that specifically finds themselves working with and handling many low income individuals. I will be conducting interviews with these individuals over the phone and will then incorporate into the paper in the form of case study analysis. I'd like to find several people form each of the bike collectives that fit the stated precondition, so please pass this on to other's in your collective that may be interested. Please respond promptly with: Your Name: Collective's name: The location of collective: Phone number: Best Times to Talk: Thanks! Christopher Shirley Undergrad at Yale University

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On Shop tools
by Sherief 08 Apr '08

08 Apr '08

Hello all, This is Sherief from the Austin Yellowbike, and I was hoping to pool the thinktank's experience with shop tools prone to breakage and the like. We're currently having huge issues keeping up with Chain Tools and Presta Valve pumps especially... it feels like not a week goes by without at least one of each of these tools breaking. W/r/t the chain tools, we recently switched from the nicer Park tools to the cheapest we could get out of the catalog, but with the way those break there's effectively no net savings and even when they are functioning the new cheap ones are no good. We try to make sure people know how to use the tools before they do, etc. But my question(s) today is: Do people have any similar experience out there with broken/breakable tools-- specifically good ways to prevent these breakages? Does anyone have any recommendations for good chain tools /PV pumps that can withstand a bit of overeager volunteering? Best, Sherief

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Re: [TheThinkTank] (no subject)
by dragonfly＠mac.hush.com 06 Apr '08

06 Apr '08

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hello, Everyone. Detroit's own Bec Young, the wonder woman of Back Alley Bikes, has a new print ready and up for viewing on the JUSTSEEDS website. It's called "Deeper Than Mechanics Dare". All this stuff about shop tools and budgeting is pretty great. Thank you for all the helpful information. As soon as this kid is born and I've figured out the immediate lay of the land for the next bit of my life, I'd like to see about starting a community bike shop here in Windsor, Ontario, just across the river from Detroit. Windsor has a city bike plan that seems to consist of printing car bumper stickers that say "Share the Road", and Detroit does not have a city bike plan. I've submitted a session proposal to this year's Allied Media Conference in Detroit for a session that would allow anyone who was interested to help work to create a Detroit-Windsor/ Windsor-Detroit regional bike plan. I don't know if they will accept that proposal yet, especially as I'll have to help organize it and then let it go-- I'll be home in Toronto with my absolutely brand new little kid when the conference takes place, and someone else would have to run the session. This whole attempt to create a grassroots (and actually designed by people who use their bikes as their primary means of transportation)regional bike plan here, right at Ground Zero of the car culture, should be interesting. Not many places have the opportunity to figure out how to make an international border crossing point bike friendly-- never mind city counsel-- try figuring out how to approach Homeland Security! We're dealing with sprawl, the auto industry, crazy economic and racial divides, and a whole host of other issues, including the gender problems, which I've written about before. I'm writing about this here, because at some point we're going to have a wiki up, and helpful suggestions and insights from accross the continent would be welcomed. Anyone who wants to write to me off list about creating bike plans, please, please do so. We need allies from everywhere to help heal Detroit and Windsor. It may seem dumb, but I think if we can get something good happening here, we could change the whole culture. (Incidentally, having bikebike! in Detroit and Windsor would be an awesome thing to consider for some futire year.) The first modern oil wells in the world were set up in this region-- in Petrolia and Oil Springs, Ontario. The modern industrial world was born on assembly lines right here. This region's industrial might was key to the Allied victory in WWII. The culture created here and rolling off the assembly lines daily is helping to kill the planet, which is a sad, sad thing, because back in the day, the decent wages and union organizing of this region was a serious force for progressive social change. We have all benefited from Detroit and Windsor. Crossing the river here was once the way from slavery into freedom. This is also the part of the world that hides Tecumseh's bones. People pass buildings named "Renaud" without knowing that that is the French word for Fox, and an allusion to the rich and complex Native American history of the region. These cities are broken, and often ugly, and unpleasant things happen here; they are also full of half-forgotten signs of the complex dynamics of the competing empires that have been fighting over the riches of the Great Lakes region for centuries. And of course, there's Motown, and Aretha Franklin and all those other people you've probably bopped around to. Every year, the Monarch butterflies come up from Mexico, and the cities are full of them. We're on a major bird migration route, too. The ecological importance of the Great Lakes cannot be overstated. If you'd be interested in learning more about this area and helping us create a bike plan that addresses the needs of people in cities in two countries, a plan that includes a strategy for trying to make a border point bike friendly, please get in touch. I'm sorry my posts are always so long, and I'm sorry to the people who have written to me off list to whom I haven't yet responded-- I'm busy and pregnant and my life's a little out of control. I'm still thinking of you-- I hope someone will reply to the post about transgendered space, too. I haven't yet, and I'm sorry to leave something as important as that just hanging out there. Thank you for writing that. Happy spring, everyone. Sasha On Thu, 03 Apr 2008 23:05:10 -0400 rachael spiewak <rachael(a)sopobikes.org> wrote: >I've read that minimum membership for any nonprofit should be $30 >(too bad I >can't substantiate that right now.. I think maybe I picked that up >from the >Thunderhead Alliance). Check on the free info on >http://foundationcenter.org. > >Here's the art show <http://www.sopobikes.org/events/artshow> >we've got >going on right now. We started organizing it in October and we've >put a >couple hundred bucks into it. I'll let you know if we make money >on it. >Other events we've got in the works are a bicycle flea market >(sellers pay >for a space in our parking lot, buyers shop for free, and we'll >encourage >the sellers to donate their leftovers to us) and a photography >print show >(lots of artists take pics in the shop.. we're very attractive >bike >mechanics) coupled with food demos in the artspace you can see in >the pics >on the art show website. > >-rachael > >On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 7:11 PM, Jennifer Nordhem ><jen(a)milehighmess.com> >wrote: > >> Yeah, we won't be selling a whole lot of bicycles. >> Our mission is primarily to teach and assist people >> with their current bikes. We will have a wholesale >> account with which we can sell them parts. I'm sure >> we will end up with a bike or two here and there, some >> used parts, etc. that we will sell, but that's not our >> goal. >> >> We are going to have a membership program which we're >> playing with right now, figuring out how to price >> things, etc. Does anyone have suggestions on that? >> Mark from Re-cycles pointed out the fault in their >> system, any other advise? >> >> In addition to profits from classes and membership we >> will be holding a monthly art show to advertise our >> services to new potential students and have a little >> fun. >> >> Jen >> Battlesteed >> --- rachael spiewak <rachael(a)sopobikes.org> wrote: >> >> > We don't sell refurbished bikes, but a good chunk of >> > our shop generated >> > funds comes from people donating $25 per frame/bike >> > they pick up from us, >> > and they tend to give more for parts even though we >> > consider parts as being >> > included with the bike. We /could/ sell whole bikes >> > for more, but that >> > seems to run up against our general shop philosophy >> > of most things being >> > mostly equal. We don't have membership fees either, >> > which is another great >> > income generator if it works for your >> > shop/organization. >> > >> > -rachael >> > >> > >> > >> > On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 12:22 PM, Mark Rehder >> > <mark(a)re-cycles.ca> wrote: >> > >> > > Same for us. Bike sales dominate our income >> > stream, with parts sales >> > > in 2nd place, and income from do-it-yourselfers >> > behind that. >> > > >> > > Mark Rehder - Director >> > > http://re-cycles.ca >> > > >> > > >> > > On 3-Apr-08, at 11:32 AM, Rich Points wrote: >> > > >> > > > I think it's safe to say that most of the >> > collectives out there >> > > > make most of their money from refurbished bike >> > sales. Last year >> > > > bike sales accounted for about 65% of our total >> > income at Community >> > > > Cycles. Refurbished bike sales are our >> > strongest fund raising tool. >> > > > >> > > > Rich >> > > > http://CommunityCycles.org >> > > > >> > > > Jennifer Nordhem wrote: >> > > >> >> > > >> Jay, We are already in the process of becoming >> > a 501(c)3. We're at >> > > >> the Articles of Incorporation and By Laws >> > writing stage. I know >> > > >> the questions I asked were lengthy, I'm just a >> > little overwhelmed, >> > > >> which I'm sure you can understand. Jen --- Jay >> > Varner >> > > >> <jay(a)sopobikes.org> wrote: >> > > >>> >> > > >>> Hi Jennifer, I'm glad you've found the wiki >> > and website useful. >> > > >>> To answer some of your questions - most (if >> > not all) the shops in >> > > >>> the community that operate on grants and >> > donations are non-profit >> > > >>> (501(c)3) organizations. I'm not sure what >> > model you are going >> > > >>> for. The answers to your questions can be a >> > bit complex. To help >> > > >>> us help you, I'd suggest giving this a read >> > and figuring out >> > > >>> where your project fits: >> > > >> http://www.bikecollectives.org/wiki/index.php? >> > > >> title=Bike_Collective_Starter_Kit >> > > >>> >> > > >>> On Tue, Apr 1, 2008 at 9:00 PM, Jennifer >> > Nordhem >> > > >>> <jen(a)milehighmess.com> wrote: >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> Hello everyone, my name is Jennifer Nordhem >> > of the soon to be >> > > >>>> Battlesteed Custom Bike Works in >> > > >>> Denver. >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> We're currently looking for places to rent >> > for >> > > >>> our new >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> shop. I noticed some people say they don't, >> > > >>> which >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> would just be a miracle that I don't foresee >> > > >>> coming >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> true. Here are the questions I have: How much >> > do you pay for >> > > >>>> rent? About how much money do you receive >> > monthly from grants, >> > > >>>> donations, membership fees, sales, etc? How >> > much do you spend >> > > >>>> monthly on tools, etc? I want to get a grasp >> > on what kind of >> > > >>> income/outflow >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> to expect so I can budget how much we can >> > afford spending on >> > > >>>> rent. Thanks everyone! The website and wiki >> > have been extremely >> > > >>>> helpful so far, I'm really happy to see >> > > >>> such >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> a supportive community. Jen >> > > >>>> >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Thethinktank >> > > >>>> mailing list Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org >> > > >> >> > >> http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank- >> > > >> bikecollectives.org >> > > >>> >> > > >>> >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Thethinktank >> > > >>> mailing list Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org >> > > >> >> > >> http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank- >> > > >> bikecollectives.org >> > > >> _______________________________________________ >> > Thethinktank >> > > >> mailing list Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org >> > http:// >> > > >> >> > lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank- >> > > >> bikecollectives.org >> > > > >> > > > -- Rich Points Community Cycles Director >> > http://CommunityCycles.org >> > > > Rich(a)CommunityCycles.org 720-565-6019 >> > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > > Thethinktank mailing list >> > > > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org >> > > > >> > >> http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank- >> > > > bikecollectives.org >> > > >> > > _______________________________________________ >> > > Thethinktank mailing list >> > > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org >> > > >> > > >> > >> >> http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank- >bikecollectives.org >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > Sopo Bicycle Cooperative >> > 404-425-9989 >> > www.sopobikes.org >> > * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * >> > Hours of operation: >> > Tues/Thurs 7 pm - 10 pm >> > Sat/Sun 2 pm - 5 pm >> > > _______________________________________________ >> > Thethinktank mailing list >> > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org >> > >> >> http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank- >bikecollectives.org >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Thethinktank mailing list >> Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org >> >> http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank- >bikecollectives.org >> > > > >-- >Sopo Bicycle Cooperative >404-425-9989 >www.sopobikes.org >* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * >Hours of operation: >Tues/Thurs 7 pm - 10 pm >Sat/Sun 2 pm - 5 pm -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Note: This signature can be verified at https://www.hushtools.com/verify Charset: UTF8 Version: Hush 3.0 wkYEARECAAYFAkf5VSAACgkQ5O7ahKJmrRnaMgCfeGfCmxUFoL29fFvMdZ0JUxQV2T8A oI+BUXvwWsTySW2MS/5iZ8hDHKxz =iPZg -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Support Community Bike Shop at Whole Foods 4/8
by Community Bicycle Shop Omaha 04 Apr '08

04 Apr '08

Hello, friends – Whole Foods is generously donating 5% of their sales on Tuesday, April 8, to the Community Bicycle Shop of Omaha. Please stop by any time on Tuesday from 8 am to 8 pm for some grocery shopping, and a portion of your purchase will go toward our operating costs. Omaha's Whole Foods is located at 10020 Regency Circle, just south of Dodge. Thank you so much for your support! The Community Bicycle Shop of Omaha

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New shop: Help me budget!
by Jennifer Nordhem 03 Apr '08

03 Apr '08

Hello everyone, my name is Jennifer Nordhem of the soon to be Battlesteed Custom Bike Works in Denver. We're currently looking for places to rent for our new shop. I noticed some people say they don't, which would just be a miracle that I don't foresee coming true. Here are the questions I have: How much do you pay for rent? About how much money do you receive monthly from grants, donations, membership fees, sales, etc? How much do you spend monthly on tools, etc? I want to get a grasp on what kind of income/outflow to expect so I can budget how much we can afford spending on rent. Thanks everyone! The website and wiki have been extremely helpful so far, I'm really happy to see such a supportive community. Jen

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info about Freehub from SF Bike Kitchen
by andrewsawtelle＠riseup.net 03 Apr '08

03 Apr '08

hey hey bike bike people people: A couple weeks back, people were asking about PoS (point of sale/service) systems for tracking parts, members, visits, all sorts of things. Here's what I got from Mario at the SF Bike Kitchen about Freehub, an online system they use for tracking members and visits. They plan to make it available soon after some other shops test it out. Email Mario at mario.bruzzone(a)gmail.com if you want to be part of the test. They want to have a big presentation of the results at the next Bike!Bike! which is September 25-28. andrew recycle-a-bike, providence ri http://www.recycleabike.org ----------------------- Hello from San Francisco! As I mentioned once or twice on the Think Tank list, the Bike Kitchen in San Francisco has been working on an open-source database program named Freehub to track our members and their visits to the shop. We've been using Freehub for about a year now, and are ready to have other shops start testing it to figure out how well it meets their needs (as opposed to just our own). We expect to have a beta version ready for widespread use in 4 to 6 weeks. We're looking for 3-4 shops to commit to using Freehub for 3 months. You're receiving this email because you've either expressed interest in Freehub directly at some point or because you recently sent an email saying that you were looking for such a program, or something similar. Here's the abstract: Freehub is a web-based system used by the San Francisco Bike Kitchen to track membership and visits to our community bike shop. We are working on a new version that will be available for free to other community bike shops through simple online registration. Freehub is: * A database of your members and the services they have access to * A patron sign in system for use at the front desk of the shop * A reporting tool for looking at shop use, membership status, earn-a-bike... Freehub is not: * A broadcast emailer - Freehub will not send emails to your members or patrons * An accounting tool - we do not track money in Freehub * An inventory tool - we do not track tools or parts in Freehub * An point of sale system - we do not track shop sales in Freehub In Freehub, your data belongs to you. Other shops can not see it, we will not use it for any purposes and you can export it in entirety at any time. * To use Freehub, you will need a computer and web access in your shop. We will provide hosting, donated to us by a fairly high-end provider called EngineYard, which specializes in Ruby on Rails (what Freehub is built upon). We'll create a url for you at the freehub.bikekitchen.org, probably something like freehub.bikekitchen.org/sfbk (to use our shop as an example). If you have questions or would like to be part of our testing, let me know. Our goal is to have a significant presentation at Bike!Bike! this year, which is a scant 6 months away! (Sept. 25-28th!) Cheers, Mario Bruzzone Bike Kitchen San Francisco

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solvents in the shop
by Michael Wolfe 02 Apr '08

02 Apr '08

Speaking of liver damage, etc.. Wondering if any shops out there have had issues solvent tanks in their shop? The fumes give me a headache but others don't seem to mind it. Mostly I worry about the health effects on the full time people in the shop. Short of installing a hood or ventalation system, what options are there to locate that stuff outside? On 4/2/08, Tom Emm <tom48236(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > Acetone, also known as propanone, dimethyl ketone, 2-propanone, > propanone2-one,and ketro-propane is a colorless mobile flammable liquid.itis the simplest example of the ketones. > acetone can dissolve many plastics including those used in Nalgene bottles > made of polystyrene, poly carbonate,and some types of polypropolene. > Toxicology:acetone is an irritant and inhalation may cause hepatoxic > effects(causing liver damage). the vapors should be avoided. always use > goggles when handling acetone. > from Wikipedia. > > ------------------------------ > You rock. That's why Blockbuster's offering you one month of Blockbuster > Total Access<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=47523/*http://tc.deals.yahoo.com/tc/blockbuster/…>, > No Cost. > > > _______________________________________________ > Thethinktank mailing list > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org > > http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… > >

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permission slips for kids to participate in your shop
by rachael spiewak 02 Apr '08

02 Apr '08

Do you have one? Can you share it on the wiki? Thanks! Rachael -- Sopo Bicycle Cooperative 404-425-9989 www.sopobikes.org * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Hours of operation: Tues/Thurs 7 pm - 10 pm Sat/Sun 2 pm - 5 pm

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Re: [TheThinkTank] solvents in the shop
by Bob Giordano 02 Apr '08

02 Apr '08

Indoor air quality is tops on our list for a healthy shop atmosphere. We do not store anything that gives off harmful fumes. Tooth brushes and simple green (highly diluted) in a small wooden bowl is our parts cleaning station. We are even moving away from simple green (i've learned it is harmful to some)- to a citrus based cleaner. I guess tri flow is the only thing with fumes in the shop. Often we ask people to use it outside. I'd like to find a non-petroleum lube. -Bob Giordano, Free Cycles Missoula Michael Wolfe wrote: > Speaking of liver damage, etc.. Wondering if any shops out there have had > issues solvent tanks in their shop? The fumes give me a headache but others > don't seem to mind it. Mostly I worry about the health effects on the full > time people in the shop. Short of installing a hood or ventalation system, > what options are there to locate that stuff outside?

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no blood for oil
by Tom Emm 02 Apr '08

02 Apr '08

Acetone, also known as propanone, dimethyl ketone, 2-propanone, propanone2-one,and ketro-propane is a colorless mobile flammable liquid.it is the simplest example of the ketones. acetone can dissolve many plastics including those used in Nalgene bottles made of polystyrene, poly carbonate,and some types of polypropolene. Toxicology:acetone is an irritant and inhalation may cause hepatoxic effects(causing liver damage). the vapors should be avoided. always use goggles when handling acetone. from Wikipedia. --------------------------------- You rock. That's why Blockbuster's offering you one month of Blockbuster Total Access, No Cost.

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