- TheThinkTank - lists.bikecollectives.org

getting and keeping kids in the shop
by veganboyjosh＠gmail.com 26 Oct '07

26 Oct '07

at Community Cycles in boulder, we're trying to nail down a formula for the kid's program(s) that works well with our facilitators, as well as our kids. we want to be flexible enough to address different learning styles, experience levels, languages, etc. we're getting better at this, as we gain experience with planning, execution, etc. one issue we were facing a while ago is that kids would join the Earn-a-bike program just for the bike. they had no interest in helping around the shop, contributing to the community of the place, etc. once they got their bike, and finished their hourwise commitment to the program, they were gone. we'd never see them again. there were some kids who we felt really got it, with regards to the bike culture/attitude we were trying to foster in our shop, our neighborhood, etc. those kids we miss the most, since they have so much potential to keep on giving, teaching other kids, staying on a bike when all the other kids are starting to drive, etc... anyway, we seem to have done something right. now we have kids who are done with their hours at the EAB program, and want to hang out in the shop. we're loathe to send them away, but what to do with them? some have brought some friends, so we've tried getting them to mentor their friend, and strip bikes, etc...we'd like to do more, and are struggling to come up with things for the more experienced/motivated kids to do while we focus on those not so experienced. the time we have set aside for kids night is kids and parents only, so it's not like we have to take time away from grownups--who, strangely, often have less patience when their question won't be answered until the kids' issue is sorted out. We'd still like to give the kids what they want, and keep our sanity. any ideas? anyone else facing similar problems? what did/do you do? i heard someone from our shop say they talked to a bunch of people at bikebike! and no one else had a model close to ours, so i'm not sure if we're the only ones dealing with this or not... thanks, and have a great weekend everyone! josh.

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Re: [TheThinkTank] Craigslist Postings
by BovineOaks＠aol.com 26 Oct '07

26 Oct '07

In a message dated 10/26/2007 1:06:11 P.M. Central Daylight Time, youractionsdefineyou(a)gmail.com writes: speculators would descend on our project and buy up all the decent stuff Now how could speculators buy parts you do not put on Craigs list. If you only list basic and medium quality stuff, you can stave off the speculators. Or you could price nice stuff appropriately! People who volunteer can earn the nicer stuff or work and pay a lessor rate for nice stuff. Win win win ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com

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Re: [TheThinkTank] wanted: good schrader head for floor pumps
by BovineOaks＠aol.com 26 Oct '07

26 Oct '07

Which two sided head are you using. I have been using the Topeak at many shops around the country. The nice thing is that you can order parts for it if you do break off the Schrader depressor you can fix it. They have one kit that contains multiple parts for all the pumps they manufacture. If you have a great pump Topeak makes a hose kit that has seven adaptors for pump bases. I am not impressed with their smart head but the two sided head has be great. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com

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IRS Workshop
by Jonathan Morrison 26 Oct '07

26 Oct '07

http://www.irsworkshops.eventsdesigner.com/ I will be attending the one in Salt Lake City, I will try to take good notes and post what I learned on the wiki. -- Sincerely, Jonathan Morrison Project Coordinator Salt Lake City Bicycle Collective 2312 S. West Temple Salt Lake City, UT 84115 w: 801-328-2453 c: 801-688-0183 f: 801-466-3856 www.slcbikecollective.org

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Wanted: Park Tool HCW-11
by Jonathan Morrison 26 Oct '07

26 Oct '07

We are looking for this tool if anyone knows where we can find one... http://biketoolsetc.com/index.cgi?id=8061721832&d=single&c=Tools&sc=Bottom-… -- Sincerely, Jonathan Morrison Project Coordinator Salt Lake City Bicycle Collective 2312 S. West Temple Salt Lake City, UT 84115 w: 801-328-2453 c: 801-688-0183 f: 801-466-3856 www.slcbikecollective.org

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Bike Collective Demographics
by Austin Amos 25 Oct '07

25 Oct '07

Is there such a thing as a listing of Demographics available for Bike Collectives. I am trying to start one in a small city / rural area in West Virginia. I am trying to understand what characteristics I should focus my research on to tell if my are will support a bike collective. I look forward to reading your reply. Thanks again, Austin Amos

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Re: [TheThinkTank] HELP! non-profit/insurance questions
by Jessica McPherson 24 Oct '07

24 Oct '07

There are a lot of good reasons for getting 501c3 status. However, I think that there is a general assumption that it is the only possible option, and some healthy questioning of that might be a good thing. At a minimum I think people should make sure they fully understand what it will mean, and what other possibilities exist. The "giving things" point is a good one. If you have no legal identity, some people will feel uncomfortable giving you stuff or money, because the only thing stopping that stuff from going directly into the pockets of the people involved is the idea that a group exists (no laws, no requirement for standard accounting practices intended to keep everyone on the level, etc.). And if you are in the market for grants, many granting agencies won't give you anything if you don't have a legal identity of some sort. Some only give to 501c3 also. That said - there are other ways to gain a legal identity than 501c3 status. And you can get insurance with any of them, which takes care of the "protection from being sued" issue. You can be a not for profit business, or a straight up business corporation (there are a couple of ways to do that, I don't know much about it). In some states it is also possible to incorporate as a collective. These do not have the tax advantages of 501c3 status gives your group and people that give to it. They do not have as many restrictions on your activity or quite as close scrutiny of your accounting (but it would be mistaken to believe you can entirely avoid accounting work by being a business rather than a non-profit, many of the standards are the same). Pittsburgh's radical bookstore decided to go one of these routes, even though they are non-profit and all volunteer. (www.bigideapgh.org) The main point that I learned at Bike!Bike! is that once you put assets in the name of a non-profit, they can't be taken out. They can only be given to other non-profits. If at some point in the future you want to do something that doesn't fully fit with what's allowed for non-profits, you can't use the money (or building, or other assets) you made as a non-profit to help you. So - I don't fully know what non-profits are and aren't allowed to do. There are restrictions on political activity and commercial activity. I'd find that out, and make sure that what you want to do with your group can fit within those restrictions. A half-way step you can take is to get a fiscal sponsorship relationship with an existing non-profit. You don't have to do as much paperwork, they help you figure out what's going on, but you have the tax and legal advantages of 501c3 status. However, as far as your assets are concerned you are still putting them in the name of a 501c3 entity, so if you leave, you can only keep them if you become your own 501c3. Anyway, that's what I know, which I feel is not enough. -Jessica ----- Original Message ---- From: Jonathan Morrison <jonathan(a)slcbikecollective.org> To: The Think Tank <thethinktank(a)lists.bikecollectives.org> Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2007 12:31:04 PM Subject: Re: [TheThinkTank] HELP! non-profit/insurance questions 1) At Bike!Bike! I was shocked by how many organizations didn't have their 501(c)(3) status yet. Plenty of organizations do not get it right away. However, I would say that as much as dealing with the IRS can suck (it actually isn't that bad) becoming an official non-profit is worth it because it makes it easy and quick for everyone to give you things -- money, bikes, tools, compressors, space, grants, you name it. In Salt Lake we were a 501(c)(3) on paper before we touched a single bike or tool. Thinking back, non getting that status would have been like trying to ride a bike cross-country sans the tires. Sure you could do it, but why would you want to? It was nice that we could just enjoy the ride, instead of worrying about every little pebble. 2) I would agree with Mario, just because you don't hear about it, doesn't mean that settlements aren't going on all the time. Besides, Murphy's Law clearly states that you will get sued right after you make a conscience decision to decline insurance. In that case, the individuals behind your organization could be stripped of anything of value and the organization will no longer exist. -- Sincerely, Jonathan Morrison Project Coordinator Salt Lake City Bicycle Collective 2312 S. West Temple Salt Lake City, UT 84115 w: 801-328-2453 c: 801-688-0183 f: 801-466-3856 www.slcbikecollective.org On 10/23/07, Mario Bruzzone <mario.bruzzone(a)gmail.com > wrote:Danny, as far as #2 for legitimate shops, yes, and it has happened with fair regularity. The most prominent example I can think of is the (failed) lawsuit against Walmart a year or two ago--even though the bikes in Walmart are often critically defective. Off the top of my head, there was also a rider who sued a shop in Santa Fe for a quick-release issue. Mostly, though, these lawsuits never make the news because they don't make it to trial. Best, Mario Bruzzone Bike Kitchen San Francisco On 10/23/07, danny wood rocknroll lazer <abortone(a)graffiti.net> wrote: i am a collective member of Krank It Up! in tallahassee, florida, and we're negotiating some possibly big (and possibly very rash and uninformed) changes. i have some questions for the listserve- 1) are there any other collective/community bike shops that have ever decided against going official nonprofit 501c3, or decided to put it off? 2) have there EVER been ANY community bike shops that have ever been sued by an injured cyclist or their family/insurance company, perhaps for allowing people to build janky bikes? has anyone ever heard of any bike shop at all (even traditional, for-profit ones) being sued for a customer getting hurt while out riding? my guess is that the answer to 2 is no; my hope is that the answer to 1 is yes. thanks! -danny = $60 Off at Overstock.com Get your free Overstock discounts only at CouponShare. http://a8-asy.a8ww.net/a8-ads/adftrclick?redirectid=f27beb132a3d1ffc4b6dd33… -- Powered By Outblaze _______________________________________________ Thethinktank mailing list Thethinktank(a)lists.bikecollectives.org http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… _______________________________________________ Thethinktank mailing list Thethinktank(a)lists.bikecollectives.org http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Thethinktank mailing list Thethinktank(a)lists.bikecollectives.org http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? 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HELP! non-profit/insurance questions
by danny wood rocknroll lazer 24 Oct '07

24 Oct '07

i am a collective member of Krank It Up! in tallahassee, florida, and we're negotiating some possibly big (and possibly very rash and uninformed) changes. i have some questions for the listserve- 1) are there any other collective/community bike shops that have ever decided against going official nonprofit 501c3, or decided to put it off? 2) have there EVER been ANY community bike shops that have ever been sued by an injured cyclist or their family/insurance company, perhaps for allowing people to build janky bikes? has anyone ever heard of any bike shop at all (even traditional, for-profit ones) being sued for a customer getting hurt while out riding? my guess is that the answer to 2 is no; my hope is that the answer to 1 is yes. thanks! -danny = $60 Off at Overstock.com Get your free Overstock discounts only at CouponShare. http://a8-asy.a8ww.net/a8-ads/adftrclick?redirectid=f27beb132a3d1ffc4b6dd33… -- Powered By Outblaze

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grant proposals
by lance ayer 23 Oct '07

23 Oct '07

Greetings all, We are in the midst of starting up a new bike coop here in Calgary. So far it is going very well, but the next task of putting together a business proposal is proving to be quite a task given our short deadline for funding and other grants. Could someone point me in the direction of some resources which could help us out in this regard? Or if any coops have copies of their own proposals available I would be most greatful if they could be sent my way. Cheers, Lance Ayer Campus Bike Initiative, Calgary

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Online Donations
by Jay Varner 22 Oct '07

22 Oct '07

For all you 501(c)3's who use PayPal for online donations, you should look at Google Checkout http://checkout.google.com/seller/npo/ It's free for a while (like till '09) and their current rates are less than PayPal's. Enjoy, Jay

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