TheThinkTank February 2008

thethinktank@lists.bikecollectives.org

53 participants
43 discussions

Is there a collective in New Orleans?
by Jonathan Morrison 06 Dec '12

06 Dec '12

Email me if you know of one. -- Sincerely, Jonathan Morrison Project Coordinator Salt Lake City Bicycle Collective 2312 S. West Temple Salt Lake City, UT 84115 w: 801-328-2453 c: 801-688-0183 f: 801-466-3856 www.slcbikecollective.org

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110 Community Bicycle Organizations
by Jonathan Morrison 27 Nov '10

27 Nov '10

We aren't alone. http://www.bikecollectives.org/wiki/index.php?title=Category:Community_Bicy… -- Sincerely, Jonathan Morrison Executive Director Salt Lake City Bicycle Collective 2312 S. West Temple Salt Lake City, UT 84115 w: 801-328-2453 c: 801-688-0183 f: 801-466-3856 www.slcbikecollective.org

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Tools for starters
by Ariel raymon 02 Aug '08

02 Aug '08

Hey everyone, Ariel from bikefarm here. We're starting to make our space into a shop, and are looking at the tools we need to purchase. Suggestions on bare minimum tools for a funcitoning shop would be really helpful, as we'll be making a large order from the UBI distributors in a month or so. Also, Are there grants for things like this? Thanks, Ariel

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direct-pull brake levers v. everything else
by Erik Stockmeier 04 Mar '08

04 Mar '08

sheldon brown (r.i.p.) went on at length all over his website about not mixing direct-pull ("V" brake, noodle brake) brake levers with any other type of brakes & vice versa. here is one quote, from http://www.sheldonbrown.com/canti-direct.html : Direct-pull cantilevers have double the mechanical advantage compared with traditional brakes, so they require special brake levers. Direct-pull brake levers pull the cable twice as far, half as hard. The lower mechanical advantage of the lever compensates for the higher M.A. of the cantilever. It is not generally safe to mix and match levers/cables between direct pull and other types for this reason. * Conventional brake levers used with direct-pull cantilevers will usually not pull enough cable to stop in wet conditions without bottoming out against the handlebars. In dry conditions, they either won't work, or will grab too suddenly. * Direct-pull brake levers used with any other type of brakes will feel nice and solid when you squeeze them, but due to their lower mechanical advantage you'll need to squeeze twice as hard to stop as you should, so unless you are a lightweight rider with gorilla-like paws, this combination isn't safe either. ...end quote so my question is this... do i need to go through my personal collection of brake levers and somehow identify/separate DP levers from the rest? is there any simple way to do this? it seems like a problem i've seen many people run in to--the brakes seem fine on the stand, nonexistant when the bike goes out for a test ride. so this is probably something we should be on the lookout for, right? ok, thanks erik of course there is this huge and boring page as well: http://www.sheldonbrown.com/cantilever-geometry.html#mechanical

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bike racks
by Liza Mattana 02 Mar '08

02 Mar '08

Hey, is there a group on this list, or does someone know of group, that is working to put more bike racks in place? a friend of mine is working with our city for more bike facilities, and i mentioned that there are bike groups around that work to put racks out there for folks. did i imagine this, or do those groups really exist? please let me know if you do this kind of work, and if you do, what kind of racks are you building and/or using. or maybe you know of someone and send me a link. thanks, liza -- Liza Mattana www.pedals2people.org Spokane, WA

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Re: [TheThinkTank] Bike Shop Competition
by troy neiman 29 Feb '08

29 Feb '08

I would like to agree with Jonathan and add to his points of establishing communication with your LBS. Keep in mind that the more people on bikes is better for everyone and especially bike shop business in general. I have found that in the case of anyone that is buying/fixing a bike at our community shop will inevitably need a retail store to buy parts/labor from at some point, and might I add that many folks who come to BICAS are just getting in to the idea of riding a bike for transportation and will many times upgrade once they get to enjoy that idea. Also, a bike rider that can fix their own flat tire, lube the chain and diagnose the problems is a happy rider and far less likely to become frustrated and stop riding all together. At BICAS we do stock some necessary new parts such as cables, some tubes and tires, chains, and simple locks/lights (priced the same as LBS as not to undercut) which we order directly from QBP or J&B importers. We do not advertise the new parts but make known the availability of these items when needed. These are also the distributors we use to get our tools. I myself work part time at BICAS and part at the LBS and can say first hand that this is an essential and benificial relationship for both. We send many folks to the LBS for newer and specific parts that we may not have and they send folks down for older, used or obsolete parts that they don't have and it works great for both. I have also noticed that when I tell someone about BICAS when I am working at the LBS they are thrilled to know about the resource and usually impressed at the honesty and collaboration between the two, which equals loyal customers. Truth is some people are Community bike people and some are bike shop people and if we can work together that means more people on bikes and more business for everyone so lets get people on bikes people! Troy Neiman BICAS Tucson, AZ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "the816bikecollective Kansascity" <the816bike(a)gmail.com> > To: "The Think Tank" <thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org> > Subject: Re: [TheThinkTank] Bike Shop Competition > Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2008 20:22:44 -0500 > > > Hey, I'm Sean with the not yet operational 816 Bicycle Collective in Kansas > City, MO. We've raised money already by holding a benefit event. We had > bands, food, and fun, and we charged a five dollar suggested donation. In > order to help us, we had some really kick ass bands. As far as spare parts > go, we've been posting all over the board asking for old parts for the last > 10 months. This actually created an excess of parts. In order to try to > avoid competition with the LBSs, we presented them (at their request) with > information about who we are and what we're doing. > > There is one LBS in our area that has helped us getting tools at cost, but > they're an owner operated company that has long wondered where the > collective was in KC. We're lucky. Basically, money and parts are free, they > just take a lot of organized effort. We have a cap of something like $80 for > all bike sales. We only sell bikes to raise funds, so basically we don't > sell bikes out of the shop. If there's a nice bike we come into and we need > money, we'll try to get it to someone via craigslist or word of mouth. > > One more thing, I personally work as a mechanic at an LBS (not the owner > operated one) and rather than an interview from my current employer, I was > basically interrogated as to how my being employed by him and being a > volunteer at the collective was not a conflict of interest. > > Again, we're not yet operational, so take this advice as you will. Also feel > free to check out our myspace page, > http://www.myspace.com/the816bicyclecollective. Look at our blog and you'll > find some specifics about our soon to be operation. Best of luck!!! > > -Sean in the 816 > > On 2/27/08, Stuart O Anderson <soa(a)ri.cmu.edu> wrote: > > > > I'm familiar with Devil Gear, and they have some unique features that > > make this difficult. Unlike most the LBS's we have in Pittsburgh, > > Devils Gear sells repaired used bikes in the 100-150 dollar range. > > That puts them in competition for both resources and market segments > > with a volunteer based community shop that's fixing up bikes for sale. > > Last time I was in New Haven they were charging about double what we > > would have priced bikes for at Free Ride, but had a somewhat higher > > median quality of bike. They also stock a fair selection of new > > bikes. > > > > I'd suggest that the New Haven collective try to avoid competition for > > now by focusing on educational program rather than bike sales. I.E. > > offering a 3 week, 6 session class in bike mechanics for adults or > > offering a build-a-bike program to local youth organizations, or > > having a sponsored tune-up-day event at one of the local universities. > > These sorts of programs take a little more effort to set up, but > > could be quite profitable. > > > > We get our parts through QBP (Quality Bike Parts) - you'll need to > > have liability insurance to get an account with them. > > > > Stuart > > > > On Wed, Feb 27, 2008 at 7:01 PM, Jonathan Morrison > > <jonathan(a)slcbikecollective.org> wrote: > > > Most of the problems I have seen in other cities are due to poor > > > communication and misunderstandings. This is my pitch, it works in salt > > > lake city -- feel free to use, modify, and/or ignore it. > > > > > > Community Bike Shops don't compete with Local Bike Shops (LBS), instead > > they > > > form a tight symbiotic relationship. Why? > > > > > > First, we serve different demographics. We serve the people that can't > > > afford or are scared of the LBS. Someone can buy a bike from a thrift > > store > > > for $25, a bike from Walmart for $100 or a low end bike from a LBS for > > $350. > > > We sell bikes anywhere from $50 to $150, so if anything we compete with > > > Walmart, but they don't seem to care. If someone can't afford a bike at > > > your LBS, send them to us! If someone is looking for a nicer bike and > > has > > > money to spend we will send them to you! > > > > > > Second, we create business for the LBS! While we have our own > > distributor > > > accounts, they are reserved for our most dedicated volunteers, everyone > > else > > > we redirect to the LBS. Our shop is open from 5-9pm so we tell them if > > they > > > can make it make it to the LBS before it closes (7PM), they could make > > it > > > back in time to install the part. > > > > > > Third, we are a tax writeoff! Get rid of used, new, old stock and make > > room > > > for things that can sell! Give it to us, and not only can you go to > > sleep > > > knowing it went into good hands -- you can get a much needed tax > > writeoff. > > > We will also publicize the fact you help your community by doing so. > > > > > > Fourth, we are your source for future mechanics. Not sure who to hire? > > > While our volunteers don't always deal with the high-end bikes, we can > > > recommend potential employees based on the more important things like > > their > > > ability to learn, reliability, ability to take direction, and their > > level of > > > customer service and passion for cycling. We train them to the point > > where > > > they could be molded into the perfect employee. > > > > > > -- > > > Sincerely, > > > > > > Jonathan Morrison > > > Executive Director > > > Salt Lake City Bicycle Collective > > > 2312 S. West Temple > > > Salt Lake City, UT 84115 > > > w: 801-328-2453 > > > c: 801-688-0183 > > > f: 801-466-3856 > > > www.slcbikecollective.org > > > > > > Get Addicted to Crank! > > > http://www.slcbikecollective.org/crank/ > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Feb 27, 2008 at 4:05 PM, Cris Shirley <cgshirley(a)gmail.com> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Hey! > > > > So we are starting a bike collective in New Haven, and had the support > > > > of our local bike shop Devil's Gear Bikes where the owner said that he > > > > would provide parts at cost and help us out on stuff. Well, now he is > > > > feeling treaten because he thinks we might start moving in a direction > > > > that may in competition with him (right now we need some start up > > > > money so we are going to fix up and sell some of the bikes we have.) > > > > Note that we have not given one bike away yet. So, I was wondering if > > > > anyone had any experiences of this sort and how they were managed? > > > > How do y'all get parts for bikes like cables and tubes and tires, and > > > chains? > > > > Thanks > > > > cris > > > > > > > > On 2/25/08, Edward France <edfrance(a)bicicentro.org> wrote: > > > > > Bike Peeps - Thought about taking a weekend out in Santa Barbara? > > > > > This is the perfect time, and we'll do our best to find hosting for > > > > > cooks, clerks, wrenches, and other forms of shop creatures that > > travel > > > > > out to celebrate with us. > > > > > > > > > > Save the Date- > > > > > Dia de Bici Cultura- the Grand Opening of Bici > > > > > Centro's new retail/educational/shop space in Santa Barbara. April > > 5th > > > > > will mark the event with Bike Art, Bike People and Bike Fun, BBQ, > > > > > evening reception with dinner, and a night ride. > > > > > > > > > > After a year of once monthly repair days, months of once weekly > > shop, > > > > > and infinite hours of shuffling around our stuff to serve in a > > modular > > > > > manner, Bici Centro finds its own 1,200 sq ft. space. We've got our > > > > > youth Earn-a-bike churning out bikes and biking kids, community > > > > > support, and a solid core of 15 volunteers working to get SB cycling > > > > > in style. > > > > > > > > > > A more detailed invite to be sent out this week. > > > > > > > > > > <a href='http://www.flickr.com/photos/xrudolfx/2285845544/' > > > > > title='Bicicentroopening by xRUDOLFx, on Flickr'><img > > > > > src=' > > http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2366/2285845544_744700953e_b.jpg' > > > > > width='1024' height='775' alt='Bicicentroopening' /></a> > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > Thethinktank mailing list > > > > > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org > > > > > > > > > > http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Thethinktank mailing list > > > > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org > > > > > > > > > http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Thethinktank mailing list > > > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org > > > > > > > > http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Thethinktank mailing list > > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org > > > > http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… > > > > _______________________________________________ > Thethinktank mailing list > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org > http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… > -- Want an e-mail address like mine? Get a free e-mail account today at www.mail.com!

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further thought on bike shop competition
by AndaLaLucha 28 Feb '08

28 Feb '08

Hello, Another positive symbiotic aspect of the LBS/Recycled Bike Collective relationship that wasn't mentioned yet is that of the repair. Countless people buy used bikes from Free Ride in some state of disrepair and then bring them to a Local Bike Shop to be repaired. This is because we only teach people how to do repairs, and don't actually repair the bikes for them. Many people have limited time, energy etc. and it is easier for them to bring their bike in to another shop for reapir. So even if people are getting the bikes in working condition from a recycled bike shop, they may later bring the bikes in to a LBS for repairs. Also, I have seen many people get their first bike at Free Ride! and then when they get really into biking, upgrade and get a nicer bike at a Local Bike Shop. Additionally, a local bike retail shop, Gatto's, that was down the street from us, loved our proximity because they could send all the people with shitty Huffy's etc. to us for repair help, instead of them having to tell the people that the repairs would cost more than the bike itself. Bike on, Andalusia

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Bike Shop Competition
by Cris Shirley 28 Feb '08

28 Feb '08

Hey! So we are starting a bike collective in New Haven, and had the support of our local bike shop Devil's Gear Bikes where the owner said that he would provide parts at cost and help us out on stuff. Well, now he is feeling treaten because he thinks we might start moving in a direction that may in competition with him (right now we need some start up money so we are going to fix up and sell some of the bikes we have.) Note that we have not given one bike away yet. So, I was wondering if anyone had any experiences of this sort and how they were managed? How do y'all get parts for bikes like cables and tubes and tires, and chains? Thanks cris On 2/25/08, Edward France <edfrance(a)bicicentro.org> wrote: > Bike Peeps - Thought about taking a weekend out in Santa Barbara? > This is the perfect time, and we'll do our best to find hosting for > cooks, clerks, wrenches, and other forms of shop creatures that travel > out to celebrate with us. > > Save the Date- > Dia de Bici Cultura- the Grand Opening of Bici > Centro's new retail/educational/shop space in Santa Barbara. April 5th > will mark the event with Bike Art, Bike People and Bike Fun, BBQ, > evening reception with dinner, and a night ride. > > After a year of once monthly repair days, months of once weekly shop, > and infinite hours of shuffling around our stuff to serve in a modular > manner, Bici Centro finds its own 1,200 sq ft. space. We've got our > youth Earn-a-bike churning out bikes and biking kids, community > support, and a solid core of 15 volunteers working to get SB cycling > in style. > > A more detailed invite to be sent out this week. > > <a href='http://www.flickr.com/photos/xrudolfx/2285845544/' > title='Bicicentroopening by xRUDOLFx, on Flickr'><img > src='http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2366/2285845544_744700953e_b.jpg' > width='1024' height='775' alt='Bicicentroopening' /></a> > > _______________________________________________ > Thethinktank mailing list > Thethinktank(a)bikecollectives.org > http://lists.bikecollectives.org/listinfo.cgi/thethinktank-bikecollectives.… > > >

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Calling out Cali Especially - Grand Opening of Bici Centro in Santa Barbara -Dia de BiciCultura
by Edward France 25 Feb '08

25 Feb '08

Bike Peeps - Thought about taking a weekend out in Santa Barbara? This is the perfect time, and we'll do our best to find hosting for cooks, clerks, wrenches, and other forms of shop creatures that travel out to celebrate with us. Save the Date- Dia de Bici Cultura- the Grand Opening of Bici Centro's new retail/educational/shop space in Santa Barbara. April 5th will mark the event with Bike Art, Bike People and Bike Fun, BBQ, evening reception with dinner, and a night ride. After a year of once monthly repair days, months of once weekly shop, and infinite hours of shuffling around our stuff to serve in a modular manner, Bici Centro finds its own 1,200 sq ft. space. We've got our youth Earn-a-bike churning out bikes and biking kids, community support, and a solid core of 15 volunteers working to get SB cycling in style. A more detailed invite to be sent out this week. <a href='http://www.flickr.com/photos/xrudolfx/2285845544/' title='Bicicentroopening by xRUDOLFx, on Flickr'><img src='http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2366/2285845544_744700953e_b.jpg' width='1024' height='775' alt='Bicicentroopening' /></a>

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Need help with outdoor bike racks
by Jonathan Morrison 25 Feb '08

25 Feb '08

We are starting to get businesses interested in bike racks. I started a wiki page for it, but I was hoping those with greater experience could help add to it... http://www.bikecollectives.org/wiki/index.php?title=Outdoor_Bicycle_Racks -- Sincerely, Jonathan Morrison Executive Director Salt Lake City Bicycle Collective 2312 S. West Temple Salt Lake City, UT 84115 w: 801-328-2453 c: 801-688-0183 f: 801-466-3856 www.slcbikecollective.org Get Addicted to Crank! http://www.slcbikecollective.org/crank/

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TheThinkTank February 2008